New JR DSX12

[Bruinbear]

Well I still want the DSX12, but will wait until the exchange rate changes, but will the UK retailers reduce the price ? Only time will tell ? As Mark said, if you want one pay the price !
As for BMFA insurance cover. Well it's not just that, but you risk large fines and even inprisonment for using non UK radio equipment, so you run a big risk by using imported TX's that have not been UK type approved. This is one of the reasons Macgregor use their own brand sticker so it's visually obvious between imported TX's. The CE stickers is another discussion all together.
The Futaba 14MZ is actually £1699.99 (Al's Hobbies), so take you're pick ? Then there's always the Futaba 12FG ? Mmmmm ? ....what about the DX7SE if you only need 7 channels ?
MERRY CHRISTMAS
Mike.

[mchristyuk]

Captain Crash,

No that's what I'm saying at all.

If you operate legally your insurance is valid.

The BMFA insurance is fantastic value for money.. but only if you run legally obtained, approved UK spec equipment.

If you want to run something else then you will need to find an insurer who will cover you.. but they will want to see type approval docs, etc.. if you can get it all together then you'll be sorted.

Mark

[Steve]

If you buy a UK set then which is CE marked and purchased from a UK shop, and you then have an unfortunate incident which ends up in your insurance not covering the claim because the serial number in your Tx doesn't match up with the appropriate records, where do you stand?

If this were to happen, surely it would imply that the UK shop had sourced its stock from another European country, which still carried the CE mark, but might be to a different Tx spec than our own sets.

My DSX9 was bought over the counter from a reputable shop and is CE marked, but how can I be sure it's fully pukka?

[Smoothound]

It will have McGreggor stickers not JR ones

[scallybert]

And here we go again with the "lets bash the importer and shops" because our modelling goods are more expensive..

Oh, I bash the manufacturers too...

There's nothing cast in concrete about the prices that the manufacturers charge the importers, the margin the importers add on, or the margin the retailer adds on.

The assumption that the exchange rate adding 30% to the 'cost to the importer' is going to add 30% to the retail price, and the customers will accept this (in a recession) seems unreasonable.

Sure, the exchange rate will cause some pain - but that pain can be shared with the other parties, rather than all dumped on the customer.

Why should they take some of that pain ? Because they want to sell the product.

If nothing else, manufacturer, importer & retailer need to remember they can't sell for a price higher than the customer is prepared to pay.

[Bruinbear]

The BMFA have said that if you have done your best to assure your TX is UK spec then you would be covered by them regarding insurance. If you've bought from a UK retailler and the TX has the correct UK stickers, ie, Macgregor not JR, then you've done your best to be UK compliant. If you knowly bought from abroad, then your on your own.
Regarding UK prices, it does seam that all cost are passed onto the customer. This includes the cost of getting UK CE approval ! All we can do is hope the street prices are a little more reasonable. There are a couple of retailers that do their best.
Mike.

[mchristyuk]

Steve,

The resposibility lies with the importer. Therefore if you bought the set off the internet from an offshore establishment you will be classified as the importer... if you bought it from a UK shop then they will have to explain why they are selling illegal goods.

Scallybert,

Agree totally that something is only worth what somebody is prepared to pay for it.

But.. lets take an example.. say the importer pays £500 for an item and the exchange rate has gone recently from 210Yen to 133Yen. That means that item now costs the UK importer £800. Let the shop add on their margin and the retail price has jumped from £665 to £1064.

Everybody is finding it hard and is trying to make the most they can out of the meagre sales.. If you discount too heavily you will just go bust.

At the end of the day this is a hobby and everything we buy is a "luxury good".. we don't have to have any of them. Look after your family first and if you have enough left over to buy toys with then great. The situation is far worse for those who actually have to earn a living out of these "luxury" goods as they are the first to be culled from the expenditure..

Mark

[Captain Crash]

It's all complete bollocks and only serves to allow everyone in the world to buy anything and everything cheaper than UK residents.

i understand CE approval costs thousands sometimes millions to get and has to go through extensive and rigorous tests but why?????

Because some wan**r somewhere sat at a desk, a wannabe politician no doubt, dreamed up a plan where every other countries standards weren't good enough and cos us Brits lead the way in Fu**ing everything up decided to set an almost unattainable standard for device compliance leading to manufacturers having to jump through hoops to be able to meet them just so they can sell the very same equipment that they sell all over the world in the UK.

I don't suppose for one minute that any of the CE testing monies goes to the Government does it???

Someone please explain to me the dangers of a higher output TX from the US as opposed to the far more expensive CE APPROVED UK Variant.

Has there been thousands of related incidents that would have been avoided had they been CE approved??? Me Thinks Not!!!

Anyway Rant Over, god i wish i could afford a 12X, i'm JR through and through and would love to replace my 10x with a 12x i guess i'll just have to save up for another few years!!!

[scallybert]

But.. lets take an example.. say the importer pays £500 for an item and the exchange rate has gone recently from 210Yen to 133Yen. That means that item now costs the UK importer £800. Let the shop add on their margin and the retail price has jumped from £665 to £1064.

Are those numbers based on experience ? They're completely out of line with what I'd expect.

I'd expect the manufacturer to be paid 1/3 (or less) of the retail price. [There's at least some factual basis to this.]

Another thing to bear in mind is that if exchange rates make country's exports more expensive, their imports (and therefore costs) reduce. So they may be able to cut their prices without too much pain.

Everybody is finding it hard and is trying to make the most they can out of the meagre sales.. If you discount too heavily you will just go bust.

They'll also go bust if they can't maintain sales, because the market won't accept what they're trying to charge...

At the end of the day this is a hobby and everything we buy is a "luxury good".. we don't have to have any of them. Look after your family first and if you have enough left over to buy toys with then great. The situation is far worse for those who actually have to earn a living out of these "luxury" goods as they are the first to be culled from the expenditure..

Yes. But I'd see that as a reason for them to strive to keep prices down, rather than try and keep the business afloat off the back of the few customers that will buy at high prices.

I don't want to see people go bust, but I think some of the prices hikes are taking the mickey.

[mchristyuk]

Captain Crash,

You're right it is a complete pain in the @rse and I'm sure the importers and shops would love to be able to sell things at the same price as the US without having to go jumping through the red tape nonsense that we do.. unfortunately it's the joy of being in the EU...

Scallybert,

No those figures are just picked out of thin air I'm afraid.. I was just trying to show how a change in the Yen at the buying end can have a large effect on the end retail price.

You're right that they'll go bust if they can't sell the stuff either.. but put yourself in their shoes. Your main product line comes in from the far east and has just pretty much doubled in price over night. If you carry on selling at your current prices you'll be making a loss on every item sold. You're entering a recession and those with disposable income for such luxury goods is shrinking. You have to put your prices up to survive.. but you're going to get crucified by your customers for doing so and you're going to have even less people buying.

Case of damned if you do..damned if you don't!..

However if you look at the airline industry, which is pretty much another luxury goods business, there have been a number of the budget tour operators go to the wall recently because they were working on next to no margins. It's all very well discounting away to get a sale but if you're not making any money then you'll soon go to the wall and that will be the end of that.

Mark

[BobJ]

Hi

I agree 99.9% of CE and UK testing is worthless bollocks but how would you feel if you found out after a few years of use that your radio was causing brian tumours or how about your home wireless router, what if that was slowly killing your family!?

Both are unlikely but I think valid reasons for having testing, sure we could generally accept US aproved goods as been OK but certainly not anything straight from China.

Cheers
Bob J

It's all complete bollocks and only serves to allow everyone in the world to buy anything and everything cheaper than UK residents.

i understand CE approval costs thousands sometimes millions to get and has to go through extensive and rigorous tests but why?????

Because some wan**r somewhere sat at a desk, a wannabe politician no doubt, dreamed up a plan where every other countries standards weren't good enough and cos us Brits lead the way in Fu**ing everything up decided to set an almost unattainable standard for device compliance leading to manufacturers having to jump through hoops to be able to meet them just so they can sell the very same equipment that they sell all over the world in the UK.

I don't suppose for one minute that any of the CE testing monies goes to the Government does it???

Someone please explain to me the dangers of a higher output TX from the US as opposed to the far more expensive CE APPROVED UK Variant.

Has there been thousands of related incidents that would have been avoided had they been CE approved??? Me Thinks Not!!!

Anyway Rant Over, god i wish i could afford a 12X, i'm JR through and through and would love to replace my 10x with a 12x i guess i'll just have to save up for another few years!!!

[Thomas]

The JR CE thing is something that has been blown out of proportion and there has been lot of scare-mongering, probably fuelled by the UK distributor - I spoke to someone ion the know about this and was told that for JR and Spektrum to make a separate unit of different regions would not be viable so there is a very high chance that most have the same output power, however 2.4 is more widely used in other areas in the US and at greater power.

CE testing is in no way bollocks, it protects consumers from sub standard and unsafe products, if you buy a piece of glass is nice to know it will do the job and be strong enough for the purpose you bought it for, in the same way radio equipment needs to be correct and not to interfere with other users and for other user not to interfere with us and also not to output at unsafe levels.

Saying that, how on earth does JR justify £1700 for a radio that is little more than their £300 set, I thought the 12fg was a lot but this is a bloody rip off.

[simon_t]

"...causing brian tumours"

Bob - why are you picking on poor old Brian???

[MrB]

Has anyone actually been refused "insurance" because of of an imported TX , I just can't see this being an issue, would the Police or anyone else know if it was a imported TX or not..Worse case-your wayward HBK knocks out a whole line of folks at the bus stop not good I admit but whilst the injured are being treated your off buying a legit TX-

In any case the bmfa have said they would cover none Uk spec TX as long as you didn't know,and that'll include the ce mark too, in law I'd suspect they'd have a hard time refusing a payout just cause of a little sticker when the equipment is the same.

all IHMO....




Mark.

[raptorheli2]

being refused and not paying out in the event of an incident is an entirely different thing though surely?

would the police know, yes would be the answer there i would assume as it is very easy to check.

as for hard time in law not paying out, insurance companies make their own laws and can afford better lawyers than us.

i can only liken this to a friend who had his car chipped and didn't tell his insurance. i don't know what the odds of getting caught are but his insurance clerk/assessor seen the chip and bye bye insurance. had to foot the bill to fix the other parties car out his own pocket. he was lucky there was not any injuries involved given how bad the accident was and also how much debt he would have found himself in.

cheers