Flybar Weights

[Granpappy]

Hi there. My TREX 450 is quite skittish when it's gusty. I've been thinking about fitting some additional weights on the flybar shaft up against the paddles to try and make it a bit more stable when the wind is gusting. I was wondering if anyone has tried this and come across any adverse effects by doing this and also whether this would work.

My alternative would be getting a fbl 450 in the hope it might cope with wind a bit better. Trouble is I don't want to buy a whole new set of batteries for the 6S which comes with GPRO but the 3S version comes with 3GX and is only about £25 cheaper. As I want the GPRO version I am hoping that I could buy the 6S and change the motor over to the 3S version. Is this worth it or should I just fork out on 6S batteries that probably wouldn't be of any use in any other model.

I have a 500l GPRO which I fly up at the field and it's quite stable in the wind, but it's a bit big for taking up on the heath where people and dogs sometimes are out walking. The 450 size is better for that and walking up to the heath is much easier when I've only got an hour to spend then driving out to the field which is about 8 miles away. This is why I want to keep flying a 450 size. If only the wind would stop gusting every day.

Thanks

[trillian]

When I was flying a Trex 450SE I used weights and KBDD paddles and this worked very well, the weights allowed me to tune the flybar for windy conditions and the KBDD paddles are quite aggressive for fast cyclics.

I always start by finding the ideal weight of the paddles, what you want is for the flybar to counteract just the right amount so that the heli corrects itself in the wind. Obviously it will drift a bit, that's inevitable, but if the balance is right it will stay pretty stable. If the paddles are too light the flybar will be very active and will over-correct and pitch the heli into the wind. If they're too heavy the flybar won't be active enough and the heli will pitch in the direction of the wind.

I don't remember how much the weights weigh, it's just a few grams. You can slide them outward if the paddles need more weight or bring them in if the flybar is too heavy.

[Granpappy]

When I was flying a Trex 450SE I used weights and KBDD paddles and this worked very well, the weights allowed me to tune the flybar for windy conditions and the KBDD paddles are quite aggressive for fast cyclics.

I always start by finding the ideal weight of the paddles, what you want is for the flybar to counteract just the right amount so that the heli corrects itself in the wind. Obviously it will drift a bit, that's inevitable, but if the balance is right it will stay pretty stable. If the paddles are too light the flybar will be very active and will over-correct and pitch the heli into the wind. If they're too heavy the flybar won't be active enough and the heli will pitch in the direction of the wind.

I don't remember how much the weights weigh, it's just a few grams. You can slide them outward if the paddles need more weight or bring them in if the flybar is too heavy.

Many thanks for your help. I'm guessing that this is pretty much trial and error with no set formula to start from. I'll certainly look at the KBDD paddles, get some weights and work my way from there. Happy days.

[electricsceadu]

the 450se v1 had as std flybar weights in the kit
a lot were never fitted/used with them
if you can't find any of the correct flybar weights i would use some wheel collets off a fixed wing model

[trillian]

Many thanks for your help. I'm guessing that this is pretty much trial and error with no set formula to start from. I'll certainly look at the KBDD paddles, get some weights and work my way from there. Happy days.

I may have some of the weights, I'll look through my 450 spares.

[Mike Sanders]

I used weights when I first started with my 450. They definitely made the heli more stable. I am sure that I have them somewhere. PM me your address and I will send them to you if and when I unearth them.

[Granpappy]

Everyone has been very kind with offer of weights. I do believe that I am now sorted. Thank you all again.

Graham

[dillwhacker]

Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons...
When I had flybarred 500s, it was always suggested to fit a longer flybar in preference to weights..
The idea being that it would increase stability in the wind, and improve responsiveness of the heli.
The weights I think will improve stability at the expense of control response.
Probably...

[asomaro]

whats "flybar"......

[trillian]

whats "flybar"......

Well, a long long time ago, in a galaxy far away....

[electricsceadu]

whats "flybar"......

be warned
save the flybar foundation
will whisk you away for many hours of re-training

[scallybert]

Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons...
When I had flybarred 500s, it was always suggested to fit a longer flybar in preference to weights..
The idea being that it would increase stability in the wind, and improve responsiveness of the heli.
The weights I think will improve stability at the expense of control response.
Probably...

A longer flybar has the reverse effect to weights. [Surprisingly...]

[scallybert]

When I was flying a Trex 450SE I used weights and KBDD paddles and this worked very well, the weights allowed me to tune the flybar for windy conditions and the KBDD paddles are quite aggressive for fast cyclics.

I always start by finding the ideal weight of the paddles, what you want is for the flybar to counteract just the right amount so that the heli corrects itself in the wind. Obviously it will drift a bit, that's inevitable, but if the balance is right it will stay pretty stable. If the paddles are too light the flybar will be very active and will over-correct and pitch the heli into the wind. If they're too heavy the flybar won't be active enough and the heli will pitch in the direction of the wind.

I don't remember how much the weights weigh, it's just a few grams. You can slide them outward if the paddles need more weight or bring them in if the flybar is too heavy.

Did you have the flybar paddles pitched up or down ?

[trillian]

Did you have the flybar paddles pitched up or down ?

I have always set paddles flat. I did hear something once and I don't remember where, about having a tiny bit of positive pitch but I followed the advice of the serious F3C guys and none of them that I knew of set any pitch on their paddles.

[scallybert]

I have always set paddles flat. I did hear something once and I don't remember where, about having a tiny bit of positive pitch but I followed the advice of the serious F3C guys and none of them that I knew of set any pitch on their paddles.

Right.

I was trying to think through what's happening. AUIU, the heavier the paddles, the more the heli maintains its attitude. However, that's not the whole story. Wind will (presumably) push on the fuselage trying to (simplification) tilt the rotor into the wind - which probably helps maintain position in gusts. I guess what you're tuning is how much you allow this to happen.

My approach with the Outrage G5s (350mm blades) was to run with heavily weighted paddles, on the basis of being very stable. But I guess this wasn't as sophisticated as what the F3C people are saying.

I also found that in spite of weighting the T-Rex 450 Pro paddles, I never got on as well with these as the G5s - which is why I went FBL with them. [G5s had stability ratios in the FB head. T-Rex didn't.]