Align Flybarless

[Brian Gifford]

Fascinating debate, chaps. Keep going!

[Stuart]

A Bell-Hiller flybar doesn't give you HH on the pitch and roll axes (which is what Stuart suggested a V-bar does), either in theory or my experience.

So if the V-bar does maintain attitude, it's functionally different to a fly-bar (not just faster, more effective, etc.)

Remember the HH is relative to your inputs at all times....so if you put a little right aileron in and tilt the heli it will drift off right until you move it back. But if the wind was to push the heli off to the right and no command came from you the vbar will say no and aim to keep the heli in the same attitude this does not mean that a small amount of drifting will not be possible - where talking about a disc that spinning a 2000 rpm in some cases.

[ChrisB]

If the heli is for instance blown from the side by wind and it causes the model to tilt the V Bar would see this and make some attempt to arrest the tilt as it has seen no pilot request to do so.It would attempt to stop the tilt not the movement and it certainly would not put the heli back where it started.

But from my experience if the wind simply pushed the heli sideways and it maintained a level attitude it would not be corrected and off it would go.

I still maintain a V Bar wont do anything you could not achieve with suitable flybar length or paddle weight as far as stability goes.But what it does do is allow you to have a heli as nimble as a fly when you put a command in but would have the stability of a heavy paddled flybar model in the hover.

So it can cheat and do both at once which you cant do with a mechanical alternative.

[Fast_lad]

Not wishing to get you back on track lol... but here's a few pictures of the first concept align head... It will change for sure as the head block still has the cut outs for the flybar assembly but you will get the idea.






Cheers

Chris

Fast Lad Performance
Fast Lad Performance

[scallybert]

I still maintain a V Bar wont do anything you could not achieve with suitable flybar length or paddle weight as far as stability goes.

Dunno.

With a flybar you can't get rid of its tendency to follow the mainshaft's orientation. As you say, you can slow it down by playing with weights, lengths, etc (with the associated loss of responsiveness), but I don't think you can eliminate it. You should be able to do so with an electronic system - if you so wish.

But what it does do is allow you to have a heli as nimble as a fly when you put a command in but would have the stability of a heavy paddled flybar model in the hover.

So it can cheat and do both at once which you cant do with a mechanical alternative.

I think this is where the obvious win is. You can do that, plus do 'mild to wild' at the flick of a mode switch on the Tx.

I reckon that flybarless systems will be like electronic fuel-injection on IC engines (or common rail on diesels). ie it will take a while to get right, especially as people are used to the foibles of mechanical systems; but once they're sorted they'll be massively better.

[Fast_lad]

Here's the latest video , this time with the align head on the heli.. Video quality will improve once you tube has finished processing it fully..

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15IUqw5yCJA&feature=channel"]YouTube - Alan Szabo Jr. Trex 700N ALIGN Flybarless Test 2[/ame]

Cheers

Chris

Fast Lad Performance
Fast Lad Performance

[ChrisB]

I agree that they will only get better as time goes on but Version 4 software on V bar is extremely good,God knows how good these things will be in a few years time.

Mikado already sorted the on the ground issue so the model wont tip over when you move the stick and likewise the Autorotation feel due to lower headpseed at the end.

Something to do with the Optimisers they use,it knows at your flying headpseed how the model responds in open air when the stick is moved a givem amount so when you move the stick and the model is slow or non responsive it knows either.

You have lower headspeed like during an auto for instance.
You are on the ground and the model is being restricted.
You have just stuffed it.

On either count,it reduces swash movement a bit so you get the feel of a flybar head at lower headpseed.


Just watched the second video of the 700N,i would be interested to know how well they have got the feel of it but on the face of it,watching the video it certainly seems to be very effective..

[Tim Procter]

Here's the latest video , this time with the align head on the heli.. Video quality will improve once you tube has finished processing it fully..


Cheers

Chris

Fast Lad Performance
Fast Lad Performance

Damn Chris that is the best flight I have seen Alan do in many months of watching his videos.

At 5m 90secs those 4 point Tic Tocs were insane at that height.

At 6m 20secs those low sustained backflips were awesome.

Looks like Align have got on to a winner with this FB package they are working on.

[Britflyer]

It will fly much better when he shortens the mainshaft/head block by an inch!

Paul

[raptorheli2]

can see the 3 sensors here and what looks like the mixer below it i assume. that looks very much like pots aswell on the mixer, i can't imagine what they will be used for. i was making the assumption this would need to be plugged into the pc to program it.

cheers

[andylinney]

Interesting that they've gone for a shorter throw on the servo arms too (Mikado does the same incidentally from 20mm on a flybarred head to 17mm on a FBL one)

[raptorheli2]

andy, you have to do that because of the direct input i gather.

cheers

[Stuart]

Interesting that they've gone for a shorter throw on the servo arms too (Mikado does the same incidentally from 20mm on a flybarred head to 17mm on a FBL one)

I missed that - but the pics at the end show a stock pushpull on Align discs which are aprox 15mm so I reckon he's at around 13mm from center to compensate for the bell crank.