pitch setup

[sparky]

hi guys,

ade, in another post you were helping someone with their pitch setup.

im i right in thinking that in all flight modes, even normal that you run around -9, 0, +9.

if i ran like this then in normal mode my throttle would move to idle with bottom stick, then i could maybe set 2 different head speeds for idle up 1 and 2. is this correct?

or would you set normal mode to have hover at mid stick?

cheers
mark

[Smoothound]

Not sure what Ade does but I only use Normal for starting up, as soon as I get to half stick, zero degrees pitch I flick to Idle Up.

[Disc]

Hi
I have mid stick hover for all flight modes and then when you swap
flight modes from idle 1,2 or normal the heli doesnt do silly things.

[Smoothound]

Which is fine if you don't do upside down stuff...

[Ade_Law]

well its sorta -9, 0 +9

a more exact thing would be zero centre with whatever the engine will pull at the top and bottom.

yes i fly the same in all modes.

On customers machines without governors i tend to setup either 1 or 2 idle ups it depends what the customer wants but it tends to be 1 idle up which then gets expanded to 2 when they fit a governor.

Normal mode throttle is set fairly slow with a curve that will maintain the headspeed through circuits and fairl fast descents without the headspeed changing. These models tend to be young and not run in so its impossible to fine tune the high end pitch.

Idle 1 is set faster by increasing the curve mid and 3/4 points top end pitch is fine tuned at this point using end points to give pitch that will maintain the speed.

later on when a governor is fitted. As sao says. normal mode is purely used for spoolup/shut down. then you have idle up 1 which is set to keep the gov engaged (full V just incase) with ish headspeed. this helps tame the model down for those precise hovering moves.

then for idle up 2 this is set for peak power of the motor. in the case of the hyper its 17krpm. Again a V shaped throttle curve is used.

Ade

[sparky]

pitch setup

hi ade

if you use normal mode for gentle flying with a slowish head speed when you havent got a govenor fitted then am i right in thinking that you start up in throttle hold? cause the low end trottle in normal would be set to mantain head speed in negative pitch.

i am learning to fly by myself as i have no car or anyone to take me to a field all the time. i have a shuttle zxx with a irvine 36 and a tz 30 coming as a backup model.

i do have a throttle jockey to fit to my shuttle so ill set up like you decribed with all flight modes set the same with 0 degree at mid stick and normal mode to give idle at low stick. i think it will be better to fit it anyway as i dont know what different headspeeds look like ie 1500, 1700, 1800

cheers
mark

[Ade_Law]

Normal mode throttle is at idle at full back stick. With the 1/4 stick being somewhere around -4 to -5 that is plenty enough negative to decend so 1/4 stick is the last point at which the throttle is set to maintain headspeed.

for customers without helis i use my knight 50. The setup i use for training is exactly the same setup i use for flying the model myself. Its has a little expo to tame the centre of the cyclics but it runs the full pitch range. I just use idle up 1 as it tames it down further and makes the flight last longer.

Ade

[Steve]

Sparky

Any more head speed than 1500 rpm will shake a poor old Scuttle to death. It's a 20 year old (maybe more?) airframe design which doesn't like high head speeds.

From my experience, and that of others in my club, keep the Shuttle head speed down to 1500 max. If you want more, you nedd a different heli like a Raptor.

[Dedcalm]

I believe that it is a good idea to start in throttle hold anyway to avoid mistakes with Idle up's and governors (I have been stupid enough to start my OS Hyper 50 with TJ Pro in Idle Up 1 ops: never again! :roll: )

I have re-programmed my mixes so that gyro mode, idle up's and governor are all on different switches (FF9).

I have also added a couple of programmable mixes for cyclic to throttle to help the TJ Pro keep track of demands. Currently only have 10% mix but this may need to be increased to ~20%....

Rob

[Smoothound]

I thought the whole point of a TJ or GV-1 was to hold the rpm constant and avoid having to bugger around adding mixes to help them along :?

[Dedcalm]

Indeed the governors do keep the head speed constant or as close as possible should the engine be bogged down etc, not that I have managed this.

That said the TJ Pro and probably the others have a look forward algorithm to help keep the head speed so by looking at throttle changes (and thus pitch changes as they are mixed on 1 stick) it can predict the requirement for more or less throttle for a given manouver.

By adding mixes for cyclic this helps with the TJ's throttle predictions so cant do any harm.

It was admittedly an exercise in programming mixes for me as I have not done any heli ones before, so more of a learning exercise with the FF9. The 9254 on the throttle is certainly faster than the 9252 on pitch so the throttle should always be well ahead of the pitch anyway with the governor disabled.

Rob

[Ade_Law]

i use cyclic - throttle mixes on the knight with a rev-lock. makes a noticeable difference in tic-tocs. Its not something that needs to be tweeked or fine tuned. just add 30% to help the gov see the extra load coming.

Ade

[Dedcalm]

Oh how I would love to be brave enough to try anything remotely near a tic toc outside of XTR 8O
Once the heli has had its service completed and I am happy with the new curves etc. then I hope to expand my flying envelope (I have been inspired by Alan Szabo's DVD 8) ). Problem is it comes down to having a go at things and for that you need large testicles and/or an equivalent bank balance which sadly I dont really have currently :roll:
On a more +ve note I guess a crash only grounds you for a few weeks while the pennies are saved

30% sounds like quite a drastic amount, what does it behave like with the governor disabled with that amount?

Rob

[Ade_Law]

spend an hour or 2 on a buddy lead (preferably with me :-) its a great confidence boost and helps to make it easier as that person will be able to help fix any issues you are having.

Ade

[Dedcalm]

Strangely I have been considering this as a birthday present option not investigated cost etc yet but its not too far from Woking... well no more that 2 hours even with my sense of direction LOL

Rob