Align 3G Sensor Enhancements

[Tim Procter]

I cannot see how tampering with and bodging things like this is the sensible thing to do,

Its no different to using a velcro strap to hold it down tight.!!

They have just secured the sensor from the inside, not the outside.

just get one that works, there are loads of good units out there,

It does work, it works loads better with the mod done.

I have only ever seen a heli hovered with this align gear on it, does anyone actually fly with it.

No it doesnt fly 3D, Just hovers..

[millerman]

I for one would like it kept well away from me and the pits, I cannot see how tampering with and bodging things like this is the sensible thing to do, .

if a modification makes something perform better it cannot be classed as less safe !
i have read the thread on helifreak and all the americans are prasing this idea yet as per normal the english slate it not sure why really is it cause its an align part ? and there are too many haters ? lets look at another thread currently on this forum regarding a beastx tail problem nobody in that thread has said anything bad about the actuall product but the unit clearly cant control the tail does that make it safer than a modded align fl760 ? if it was an fl760 tail problem i can guarentee one of the first replys would be "align unit is rubbish or bin it or some rubbish.
if you cant make comments without slaging a product i would rather not hear you comments.

[acwman]

Agree with the bashing the product bit.. I’m guessing it’s all part down to snobbery. It’s all very well, owning a product which is twice the cost of an align 3g, or that they own the very latest new fbl system, and comparing it.

Although I am far from being an Align fanboy, look where the company and how they have diversified from electrical home appliances, to probably the largest model helicopter manufacturer this world probably has ever seen, and all done in a short number of years. They are the ones, which probably not only stepped the game up model helicopters in this hobby, but also by bringing out to the masses, a flybarless system which tbh was not all bad for a price that normal folk could try fbl. Not to mention that had align not turned down Freakware, the Beast may have never came out! With the new 2.1 firmware, things got better, and it does seem to show that they want to improve their products.

There are a lot of ppl using the 3g that don’t have issues that just don’t come onto forums and praise it. Lets not forget that most ppl do come onto forums for help… so you only get the bad reports and press… and a number of these can just be down to poor maintenance of the helicopter, and bad mechanical setup which creates the issue in the first place! There are probably 10x (If not more)as many align FBL units than any other fbl system out there……you are therefore going to get more moans about it.

For me, finances at present prevent me from purchasing a Beast, though I won’t deny that I am dying to try one out. I’ve heard from many competent flyers on how well it does fly.. and I have no doubt in disbelieving them.

Through this 5 minute (If that) Mod on the 3g, I have to say though, I am now in no mad rush to try a Beast. I believe it is like having another system on it. It is that much more stable, and that bit more hold, which is all good.

For those which say that I should bin it and just buy a unit which works in the first place…

Not so long ago, I tried a brand new Mini V on a beam 450. As with any product you buy with your very own hard earned cash(especially when it’s expensive!); you always are going to say to yourself that you made a fabulous purchase! I fitted it in, and thought how this holds and sits so much better than a cheap align. I then flew nothing else for the next week… until I stopped looking at my product through rose coloured spectacles, and started seeing things I did not like about it.. Firstly it seemed far to susceptible to vibrations, and it ended up drifting.. and then there was a very annoying hesitancy in fast smack moves…where in some manouvers where you punched collective, and there seemed to be a big delayed reaction from the stick to what the heli actually did. Some tweaking improved things, but it was never totally gone. The bad drift always came in if the headspeed was too high..ie idle 2.. drop the headspeed, and it went and hold was very good, though dropping the headspeed just to get rid of the drift was not ideal for my flying.

…basically I swapped the Vbar with a 3g unit with a good friend of mine; Originally, it was just to test, but I ended up doing a straight swap!

As soon as the 3g was fitted, the drifting went straight away.. no problems at all! The 3g does not suffer from the hesitancy which I described of the vbar. I was running the Vbar on V4, so unsure if V5 would have solved anything…

Now with the Mod on the 3g, it’s very much as locked in as the vbar on the 450 had ever been, so I am very happy with it. In the end, it’s the 3g users own choice whether to do a simple mod to improve its flying characteristics or not… Though it must be advised that it would void the warranty!… but hey.. s/h prices will be a good buy, especially when the hype is to bin the unit..haha!

I think that if you do have a 3g, and you are stuck with using it, want to be able to increase the cyclic gains to improve stability and hold... It has done all this for me..and would think seriously of doing it....Just don't hold me responsible if you do bodge this simple process up

Personal choice is that with this mod, I definitely prefer the feel of the 3g over the mini V on my 450 helis.

I do also run vbars on a trex 500, and Logo 500, but find that they seem to run extremely well on them… Its just the 450 that I have not enjoyed the vbar with.

BTW.. Having heard reports of the main lead working loose out of the main control box on the vbar, I have Modded it by putting a blob of hot glue to ensure it will not fall out in flight…… A good mod?…. or should I have just binned the unit!”

[raptorheli2]

i suspect the reason this works is your adding mass to the sensor. if you don't want to put silicon inside the unit you could maybe get a thicker/heavier metal plate to mount it which should have a very similar effect if done correctly.

cheers

[millerman]

i suspect the reason this works is your adding mass to the sensor. if you don't want to put silicon inside the unit you could maybe get a thicker/heavier metal plate to mount it which should have a very similar effect if done correctly.

cheers

there is also talk of placing a square cut section of align / zeal type servo mounting gel inside again adding mass i guess.
like i have said i have done this to my 250 and boy does it make a difference and im yet to turn up the gains to see even more from the unit
yes im an align fan boy but also a recent convert to the outrage helis too and
why spend another 150 quid or more on a beastx or vbar when im still sure i have not got the beast out of my align flybarless setup and anyway if i wanted to do a hands free hover i would have brought a heli command meow

[stillakid]

It really does work!

I can understand the various comments raised about the 3G systems requiring work to get them sorted while others work "out of the box" & for some, the idea of junking it for something else might not be an option.
After my 700N got rolled over on spool-up by the 3G (trying new sensor mounting combinations) I did take it off & replaced it with a BeastX. However, not wanting to throw it away & given the thread on Helifreak, I decide to have a go with "the mod". If you read my posting on Helifreak in the mod thread you will see I went about it slightly differently. All I can say is it has made a huge difference, so much so I need to make mods to the heli (T600ESP) to make the most of it! The 3G link is required to get things right, the mod alone does not give so much improvement.
It is not a question of just adding mass to the sensor, there is a resonance between the two upright sensors & the motherboard & case which needs to be supressed. My mod added 1.2 grams to the sensor weight.
For those with 3G & thinking of changing, why not try it. Read the thread & have a go. What have you got to loose?

[sycomoto]

just modded all three of mine

well even though i didn't think there was anything wrong with mine i decided "what the hell" and took all three of mine apart and applied some loctite 5920 which is electronic safe. Now i'm just waiting to see what the weathers doing to go try it out. Now the only question i've got is do you have to use 3g blades as my 700 and 250 are running the standard blades.

[millerman]

well even though i didn't think there was anything wrong with mine i decided "what the hell" and took all three of mine apart and applied some loctite 5920 which is electronic safe. Now i'm just waiting to see what the weathers doing to go try it out. Now the only question i've got is do you have to use 3g blades as my 700 and 250 are running the standard blades.

No the 690d on the 700 work just fine and the 205d Work good on the 250 you should find if you have kept the same gain settings the models should be quite docile now so be prepared to up the gains ;0)


Sent from my iPhone using crapatalk

[coolice]

Hey All.

I've modded all my Align 3G'd models and while I can't say I've noticed any real improvement it's not made things any worse. However the jury is out as to if there is a major gain to be had, or for a lot of people the resetting up after the mod improves things as the basic machine setup is better. Maybe I dont know.

Originally I tried this on my 450 PRO but using hot melt glue as this is all I had to hand at the time, didn't help my elevator porpoising in FFF but again didn't harm it.
My 700E and 550E did not have quirks or problems I needed to fix and so were done more recently to see if they could be improved.

My feelings are similar to raptorheli2 in that any gains can partly be attributed to the increased weight meaning the mass of the 3G sensor is greater, my only thought on this is that there is then more weight to flop about in hard 3D. Hence why the more rigid mouting perhaps, but so far apart from my 700E which works great using the Spartan mouting setup, my 550E likes the Align pad and my 450 PRO a CSM foam.

One area I do feel is an improvement is in removing the moulded tabs protruding down from the top of the case, which guide and support the cyclic gyro sensors. In flight I have a sneeky feeling these act like wood peckers on the sensors upsetting the them and with no damping there I wonder if they do make things worse. Iv'e removed all mine.

Looking at the settings posted by Leon Luke and chatting with the Osbournes last night, it is felt that the heading lock gain on the cyclic gyro's is perhaps key to getting a better flying model.
By lowering the heading lock gain values from the stock 70 to around the 40 mark, you are able to up the actual gyro gains without getting so much bobbling if any at all. This has been the case with Duncans model, running a lower heading lock gain allowed him to wind the gain pots on the main unit up to 100% with no wobbles.

Just last night I have made these changes to my 550E, reduced heading lock gains on aileron & elevator down to 40% and am waiting to test tomorrow weather permitting to see the result.

Now the only question i've got is do you have to use 3g blades as my 700 and 250 are running the standard blades.

Hey.

When I first fitted the 3G to my 700N I kept with the stock 690D's and the model flew well, not twitchy or intimidating to fly. When I got my 700E straight away I fitted the 690 3G's and these do feel a bit nicer, but of course these are two very different models and so it's not far to fully compare. The complete head, radio gear and 3G is the same as was in my 700N so the base components are the same.
Back on my 700N I never felt the need to update from V1 firmware on the 3G, the model felt great as is so I left it. My 700E, while ok didn't feel quite as good off the bench and so I finally bit the bullet and applied V2.1 to this model and I felt the difference! It made it much better, whether this was due to the different blades perhaps changing the way the 3G sensed the model I do not know.

Definetly blade weight and C/G plays a big part on the FBL models, my 450 PRO being a good example as I struggled to get it to track well in FFF on the stock Align blades. After fitting harder dampers, numerous 3G mounting pad tests, a set of Maniacs @ 29 grams each fixed my elevator porpoising and it's nice to fly in a straight line.
In light of this I'm inclined to say the smaller models benefit more from heavier FBL blades than the larger machines.
.

[sycomoto]

bugger

done the mod and upgraded the 3g to 2.1 and now both the 250 and 550 are all over the place. i don't think its the senser mod more likely i've done something wrong when doing the 2.1 upgrade. i used the update screen to take it to 2.1 plugging the senser in first then unplugging and doing the control box and all went well. now am i suppost to set the endpoints or not, cos i did the 550 and had a few issues but didn't on the 250 as the swash was moving in the right direction. after this i went into the gui and set both to factory settings from the drop down menu and downloaded as per the instructions.
The issues i have is the 250 is skittish and all over the place, i'm all over the place. The 550 is similar just a lot more controllable. any ideas.

[pcollins]

done the mod and upgraded the 3g to 2.1 and now both the 250 and 550 are all over the place. i don't think its the senser mod more likely i've done something wrong when doing the 2.1 upgrade. i used the update screen to take it to 2.1 plugging the senser in first then unplugging and doing the control box and all went well. now am i suppost to set the endpoints or not, cos i did the 550 and had a few issues but didn't on the 250 as the swash was moving in the right direction. after this i went into the gui and set both to factory settings from the drop down menu and downloaded as per the instructions.
The issues i have is the 250 is skittish and all over the place, i'm all over the place. The 550 is similar just a lot more controllable. any ideas.

I would try rolling one unit back to v2.0. You can find the v2.0 update in the align folder in c:\programe files. This will rule out any issues with the unit it's self.

As far as the mod goes what did you use to do the mod?