Sats ~ Flashing

[coolice]

i get this using a powerjive bec, think is default set to 5.7v??

Hey buddy.

You may find its the amp capability more than the volts during high load, but of course both values fo hand in hand when powering our flight gear.

The Jive BEC's are good, but off the top of my head don't have a lot of overhead and so some setups may tax them more than others.
One of those Opti Backup Guards would be good on this occasion as a safe guardoto power lose.

I ditched my Align regulator off when I went flybarless in favour of a Gryphon Vega

I managed to drop the power to my beastx today though lol, according to the TM1000 it was down to 3.8v It never showed any losses or fades so I guess I got lucky, that was on a freshly charged lipo too.

I'm now considering x2 life packs to go with my mains.

Hey buddy.

There is a good video showing the voltage point at which the Spektrum and Futaba gear brownouts at, if I find it I'll post it.
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[coolice]

I've got a Castle 10amp peak 25 max bec I can replace it with that should do the trick...? forgot I fitted one of these on my 500 good year ago now I sure was for same reason.

Hey Jim.

This is the smaller CC BEC isn't it? This is still not good enough for 600+ machines unfortunately, you need the BEC PRO or a different one.
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[Grumpy]

Like i said in the last post, if the OP is not turning his Tx off between flights then it's perfectly normal to get a false brown out indication from any DSM2 receiver or satellite. it's got nothing to do with low voltages or inadequate BEC.

The reason is that if the receiver on power up 'sees' the same two frequencies from the DSM2 Tx that it 'remembers' from last time, it 'assumes' there has been a Brown Out. The only way to avoid this is to power cycle the Tx between flights so that the receiver selects different frequencies. Alternatively use DSMX which doesnt have flashing LED brown out indication (or simply ignore the flashing lights).

[coolice]

Like i said in the last post, if the OP is not turning his Tx off between flights then it's perfectly normal to get a false brown out indication from any DSM2 receiver or satellite. it's got nothing to do with low voltages or inadequate BEC.

The reason is that if the receiver on power up 'sees' the same two frequencies from the DSM2 Tx that it 'remembers' from last time, it 'assumes' there has been a Brown Out. The only way to avoid this is to power cycle the Tx between flights so that the receiver selects different frequencies. Alternatively use DSMX which doesnt have flashing LED brown out indication (or simply ignore the flashing lights).

Hey buddy.

While this is possible, it's not the case here. Also the 3GX has a safety feature in that if a brownout occured in the previous flight/power up, the next time you power up the 3GX all its lights flash and it won't bind to alert the user to a possible problem.

Also the OP has said the sats start out solid then change to flashing.

Unfortunately it's too well known the Align BEC causes this and Jim is not a newbie to Spektrum etiquette.
DSMX sats still flash to alert the user to signal breaks due to power shortages to my knowledge.
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[Grumpy]

I'm 99.9 sure that DSMX doesnt do the flashing thing, there really is no way it can due to the random way frequencies are selected. For sure I cant make my DSMX sats flash no matter what i do, unlike the DSM2 ones that do flash if you dont power cycle the Tx (even when connected to the 3GX)

I've read through the OP's posts i dont see anything that indicates it isn't simply failure to power cycle the Tx between powering down and back up of the Rx. This will cause flashing LEDs on DSM2 receivers every single time without fail.

End of the day, i think it's worth mentioning as it's a very simple thing to confirm or rule out.

This isn't to say that the standard BEc is adequate, FWIW I changed out mine for a CC BEC pro. However i'd be very surprised in it was 'browning out' consistently on the bench under little or no load, as appears to be what the Op was describing. I never had a brown out when using the stock BEC, i upgraded it mainly as a precaution. Also it it was genuinely browning out I'm sure the OP would notice the short drop out of control.

[waveydavey]

This is most likely a 'false Brown-out'. it's nothing to do with the BEC. You get a 'false Brown-out' indication if using DSM2 mode and if you don't turn off the Tx between flights.

To avoid the flashing light either turn off the Tx between flights or use DSMX mode (there is no Brown out indication when using DSMX, even in the event of a real brown out)

It wasn't as you describe, Jim was recycling the power to the Tx before restarting the 3GX, the sats were fine and showing solid as I described in my post, until the servo shuffle.

[Grumpy]

PS,

I'm now 100% sure DSMX does not give Brown Out indication by flashing LED, due as i said to the fact that the random frequency hopping makes it impossible to do so.

From Spektrum FAQ page on DSMX:

»Brownout Detection - Not Available on DSMX Receivers

DSM2 receivers feature Brownout Detection that flashes the receiver's LED if a power interruption occurs. While DSMX receivers have QuickConnect and recover instantly from a power interruption, the architecture of DSMX prevents Brownout Detection when operating in DSMX mode.

[waveydavey]

DSMX as you say don't show a flashing sat on brown out, you can check this whilst checking failsafe. Jim is using DSM2 and as above.

[Grumpy]

It wasn't as you describe, Jim was recycling the power to the Tx before restarting the 3GX, the sats were fine and showing solid as I described in my post, until the servo shuffle.

Well ok, i'll take your word for it but i know MANY people have been fooled by false brown out indication caused by failure to power cycle the Tx... so it's always worth ruling out before jumping to other conclusions.

Also to have a brown out by definition means that the Rx has shut down and re-started. This is not something that would go un-noticed when testing on the bench as the controls would fail to respond for easily long enough to be obvious.

[waveydavey]

Both sats were solid before the 3GX initialisation, at the first shuffle both sats went into brown out indication and the initialisation stopped. After trying a few times and without changing anything the 3GX went through it's startup and both sats held.

[coolice]

I'm 99.9 sure that DSMX doesnt do the flashing thing, there really is no way it can due to the random way frequencies are selected. For sure I cant make my DSMX sats flash no matter what i do, unlike the DSM2 ones that do flash if you dont power cycle the Tx (even when connected to the 3GX)

I've read through the OP's posts and I'm not convinced that it isn't simply failure to power cycle the Tx between powering down and back up of the Rx. This will cause flashing LEDs on DSM2 receivers every single time without fail.

End of the day, i think it's worth mentioning as it's a very simple thing to confirm or rule out.

This isn't to say that the standard BEc is adequate, FWIW I changed out mine for a CC BEC pro. However i'd be very surprised in it was 'browning out' consistently on the bench under little or no load, as appears to be what the Op was describing. I never had a brown out when using the stock BEC, i upgraded it mainly as a precaution. Also it it was genuinely browning out I'm sure the OP would notice the short drop out of control.

Hey buddy.

Bear in mind a brownout is a drop in system voltage, not a packet/signal data lose, so yes the DSMX is frequency hopping but still alerts users to power interuptions.
I checked, DSMX sats also blink on brownouts, it's Spektrums way of indicating this type of problem. I have a model here running a Vbar with DSMX sats and will double check, but a quick Google shows lots of flashing DSMX sat threads.
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[coolice]

PS.

I'm now 100% sure DSMX does not give Brown Out indication by flashing LED, due as i said to the fact that the random frequency hopping makes it impossible to do so.

From Spektrum FAQ page on DSMX:

Hey.

I think Jims using DSMX sats in DSM2 mode controlled from a JR transmitter, so they would indicate in this case.

This is interesting as I'm sure I've read Vbar users running in DSMX mode stating flashing sats when using DSMX and Beastx users to.
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[Grumpy]

So the system 'browned-out' before even initialising under no load at all?

That seems very strange. While I'd be first to agree that the standard Align BEC is somewhat marginal I find it hard to believe that Align would supply a BEC that was so woefully underrated that it couldn't even power up the stock system under no load? That also was not my experience with the Align BEC, although i changed it as a precaution it actually worked reliably enough, possibly the specific BEC in question is faulty in some way?

It might be worth for test purposes powering the 3GX off the CC 10A peak BEC mentioned previously. This should at least be good enough to check if changing the BEC actually makes a difference to the issue or if there is a fault elsewhere.

[Grumpy]

Hey.

I think Jims using DSMX sats in DSM2 mode controlled from a JR transmitter, so they would indicate in this case.
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Yes, that will be the case. The fact that they were flashing at all proves DSM2 mode was being used. DSMX sats will flash for brown out when used in DSM2 mode, but it's impossible for them to do so in DSMX mode, as per Spektrum FAQ. If anyone stated different then they were mistaken.

What's often not understood is that the flashing LED brown-out indication is not initiated by low voltage detection at all, but by the receiver turning off and coming back on again to find the same two DSM2 frequencies being transmitted. The Rx has no way of knowing if it has been off for a ten milliseconds, ten seconds, ten minutes or ten days. All it 'knows' is that the frequencies it detects are the same as last time it operated. When these same frequencies are detected that triggers the flashing lights. That's why not power cycling the Tx causes false brown out indication, the Rx comes back on and finds the Tx still on the same two frequencies.
This cant work on DSMX because the frequencies change constantly so the Rx will always detect new ones when it powers up, even if there was a genuine brown-out.

[coolice]

Hey.

Well I've certainly learnt something about DSMX tonight. As has been mentioned on some forums I don't know if this lack of indication is a good thing or bad thing really.

With the Align BEC, bear in mind we are now on V5 of its firmware and Align themselves advised from V4 that if your models power supply/BEC wasn't that great to keep the gain pots low as the new software pulls more amps.

It's a well known and documented problem with the Align BEC and 3GX, some Beastx users use the regulator without issue.

I'm going to check the DSMX setup upstairs as I always used the sat led as an indication of potential problems, have to rethink that now.