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Synergy N5 - My take so far....

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  • Synergy N5 - My take so far....

    Well I've built the N5 and put about 4-5 tanks through it so far. It's not flying just as I like it yet, but that will hopefully come with some adjustments to the programable head, but i'll keep you updated on how that goes.

    Kit over-view....

    The kit it-self looks like a very simple and well designed helicopter. Small parts count means it didnt take long to build, and hopefully less to break in a crash. This thing really is a .90 size with a .50 engine. The tail fin is bigger than the 700's, the overall height is only just lower than the 700, and the overall length is only a couple of inches shorter too.
    It got me a little worried that running this thing on a .50 just wouldnt cut it!

    I love the way the tail box and boom clamps are done.... Very simple, yet its properly engineered using long bolts and nylock nuts so no stripping out threads from over tightening.
    The head itself is SOOOO beefy, it's by far the heaviest part of the heli (maybe to help raise the CoG?). And the servo layout I really do like. It made wiring up a little easier than the Align's i've previously built as theres no routing wires all the way through the frames, everythijng is in 1 place at the front.

    The main frames do look nice, although I am a little worried with these. Not really at the thin point that people point out, but where the front skid mounts. Reports so far are that most crashes seem to break both frames.

    The surface finish on the machined parts, although looks nice is far from perfect. As an engineer, I dont particularly like it. It all looks rough cut with no finishing. All the head components are the same, and I hope in later batches they sort it out. Not a major issue, just something that should be done.

    The Build.....

    Building the N5 was actually quite straight forward. VERY different to building an Align heli as you will find out. Nice features like the 1 peice fuel tank gromets on Align heli's dont feature on these - Its a rubber strip that you feed round and cut to length. Not a problem, but it's small things like this that makes this heli very different to build.

    An align is bolt it togther and fly, the N5 has more adjustments that you need to be carefull with such as the engine and clutch stack alignment. It took me a while of playing around untill I got to the point I was happy with, including gear mesh.

    The manual is pretty diabolical in my view. Once you build your N5, go and read the Avant manual! Thats how it should be done!
    It is very vague, with no text or explanation through-out the entire build. What was most annoying is that the manual doesnt even tell you what effects changing the head ratio's have in flight!
    The pictures are very dark, and can make you have to check twice to see some things.

    The head, frames and tail all went together perfectly first time apart from the metal tail grips.
    Not everyone has an issue with these, but a few people have. The M3 washers supplied in the kit holding the tail grips on wants to be removed. Mine locked the bearings in the grips up. Once removed they are silky smooth. Nice features in the grips using dual radial bearings and thrust bearings. Absolubtly no play in the tail at all!
    The actual tail grips themselves i'm not impressed with either. They seem a little last minute in design.
    The machined hex in the back to locate the nut is too shallow and doesnt grip the nut. It just chews up the grip a little if you dont use a spanner on the back. The bolt supplied also has a radius on the inside edge so doesnt butt up nicely to the front face of the grip either. I will put some better quality bolts in mine to get round this. Again, its not the end of the world, but I would rather they fitted together well.
    The gap in the grips where the tail blade goes is also a fraction too wide I think. Both the plastic blades supplied and Align carbons are a very loose fit in, and when you tighten them up the grips have to bend in more than I would like as an engineer.

    Tail Blades....
    BURN THE STOCK PLASTIC BLADES!!!! They are utter useless. I had better tail blades on my very first Esky belt cp! They are as usefull as a rounded off alen key. A set of carbons transformed the tail completly.

    The belt tension...
    The manual (well, Matt Botos) says you can run the belt fairly loose and it wont slip - but it does!
    Just do it up as you would any Align tail belt and you will be fine. It took quite alot of tension before mine stopped slipping in flight. There is extra drag, but jamiem has told me that the belt will wear in and loosens up after more flights.

    Once set up, i noticed the swash hits quite badly on the headblock pins. Theres plenty of room to move the swash down, so I will try that and see if its alright. At full positive and full cyclic I can also get the shwash to hit the mixing arms. Hopefully this wont happen once the swash has been lowered more aswell.

    Flight....

    I was very worried the TT53 i was putting in the Synergy just wouldnt have the power to move it well considering it's size, but miraculasly (I dont know how!) it feels doesnt feel very underpowered considering my engine was very rich. Pitch response seems nice and quick, although my cyclic with 600SB's and white Align paddles was very very slow. I am going to re-check all my settings, alther the swash and try again before altering the programmable head, as most reports seem to imply the cyclic is very quick on Matt Botos's recommended settings. I will report back at the weekend when I've tested it.

    The tail seemed very predictable when the belt was properly tensioned, and it flew like it was on rails. Very precise, and very easy to fly. I look forward to tuning the engine, speeding up the cyclic and giving it another proper flight.

    The head dampening is very stiff. It flies great, but without enough headspeed it gets the shakes big time! So when running in your engines, try and up the headspeed as much as you can. I can't see any boom strikes happening with this model.

    I really didnt like the colour scheme of the canopy when I got it, but it's starting to grow on me now - especially since i've flown with it on. Its VERY easy to see in the air, the orange really stands out. I was going to paint over this canopy, but I think I'll wait untill the blank canopies are available.

    I will keep this thread updated untill I have the Synergy N5 flying just as I like it and post my results on the effects of changing the programmable head.
    Sponsored by - Align - CSM Gyro's - OptiFuel/OptiPower - Kontronik Drives UK
    Align 700E DFC
    www.robochallenge.co.uk

  • #2
    Good read! Cheers for posting..

    Ill get my hands on one at the weekend, wont I Jamie
    x 3

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    • #3
      thanks for taking the time to keep us updated Grant

      agree with all your comments raised so far, and yes mine is nodding a lot as I'm breaking the YS56 in, have had to run a higher headspeed than I would like really for break in

      so how much tighter have you got your tail belt now? a lot tighter than mine was on Sunday?
      Nick

      Henseleit TDR 2011 VBar 5.2, Avant Aurora, 700N BeastX, 500 BeastX

      Member of Byley MFC & South Cheshire HeliAddicts (www.southcheshire.rcheliaddict.co.uk)

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      • #4
        It's a little tighter than yours was now - but it's starting to cause abit more drag than I would like. Jamiem has been putting some tri-flow oil on his belt and said within a few tanks it's loosened up fine again, so I think i will do what he's suggested.
        Sponsored by - Align - CSM Gyro's - OptiFuel/OptiPower - Kontronik Drives UK
        Align 700E DFC
        www.robochallenge.co.uk

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        • #5
          How are you finding the undercarriage?

          I find it very narrow and can see it easily tipping over doing auto's on a bumpy field

          Haven't seen many people fitting anything else though, from recollection I did see someone using Mikado skids on another site
          Nick

          Henseleit TDR 2011 VBar 5.2, Avant Aurora, 700N BeastX, 500 BeastX

          Member of Byley MFC & South Cheshire HeliAddicts (www.southcheshire.rcheliaddict.co.uk)

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          • #6
            So far they seem OK - I havnt had any worrying landings yet (although I can see it might cause a problem at our field at midland due to the bumpy floor). I will be able to let you know that on sunday.
            I would love some proper synergy N9 style skids. I might try heating these up and bending them out a little and see if that helps. If not - I may even pick up a set of N9 skids to try (when my bank balance recovers!).

            The only other thing I can think of that could have been done better are the canopy thumb screws. Although they look very nice, theyre not very easy to get off! It would be great if they were like the Quk ones that stay in the canopy gromets aswell when you remove the canopy so you dont loose them.

            I do really like this heli though, even though I'm picking out all it's minor faults. Its really nice to have something that isnt an Align for a change.
            Sponsored by - Align - CSM Gyro's - OptiFuel/OptiPower - Kontronik Drives UK
            Align 700E DFC
            www.robochallenge.co.uk

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            • #7
              can't believe I found my two missing canopy thumbscrews on the strip on Sunday, how lucky was that!

              I know when I had my N9 I always used to use a hex driver to put them on and off as they do need to be really tight to not lose them during a flight. The design could be much better
              Nick

              Henseleit TDR 2011 VBar 5.2, Avant Aurora, 700N BeastX, 500 BeastX

              Member of Byley MFC & South Cheshire HeliAddicts (www.southcheshire.rcheliaddict.co.uk)

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              • #8
                nice report grant..keep us posted
                cheers craig
                Black Country Helicopter club.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Loctite the thumbscrews in place and do them up, leave them over nite then crack them off.

                  The residue holds them in place, and havent lost one in flight on Velo or N9 since doing this.
                  x 3

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                  • #10
                    Good tip that, thanks Paul
                    Nick

                    Henseleit TDR 2011 VBar 5.2, Avant Aurora, 700N BeastX, 500 BeastX

                    Member of Byley MFC & South Cheshire HeliAddicts (www.southcheshire.rcheliaddict.co.uk)

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                    • #11
                      I did a little playing last night, moved the right hand side ball on the bell/hiller mixing arm out to the outside hole, and instantly gained 2 degrees collective and cyclic. I've mow dialled the rates down a little and the binding is gone in all by the absolute extremes of cyclic with full +ve pitch. I have a feeling that dropping awash by 2 full turns on the lower linkages will solve this, although I ran out of time last night to try. I'm heading tot the field tonight to try it out

                      tbh I'm having more grief with tuning this OS55 than anything else! Hopefully I'll get a few tanks on it tonight and get it a bit closer to where it should be.

                      I don't agree with the comments about poor machining on the metal parts, mine all look top notch, and the fit of everything was impecible. Perhaps you are refering to the cnc cutting marks? I think these have been left deliberately, and personally really like the look of it all, especially the bell cranks

                      N9 skids will bolt straight on but I think they will look too big and probably add quite a bit of weight well away from the ideal c of g. I've had a tip over on an auto, but now I'm aware, I tend to just feed the negative in a bit quicker once Im down. Align 600 skids seem to be the sensible choice, looking almost identical but wider. This will necessetate the use of Align skid tubes and therefore requires the removal of the Align badge!!

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                      • #12
                        I have to say i agree with Grant on the Finish of the metal work looks very roughly done, and not really a surface finish you would expect.
                        That said the actuall machining work is fine its just the finish.
                        Alex
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                        Innovation RC Blog
                        Innovation-Rc on eBay
                        www.heliharry.co.uk
                        www.robochallenge.co.uk

                        500 ESP. Ely Q Comp, KASAMA'd 600

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                        • #13
                          Theres already carbon frames being produced so I wouldn't think it will be long before aftermarket skids are available.
                          Velocity 50
                          Synergy N5
                          Fury 55 FBL
                          Trex 700

                          Light travels faster than sound, this is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak....

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                          • #14
                            Let me know how it goes with the ball moved - It sounds like thats the first thing for me to try then!
                            With regards to the machining - the finish (machining marks) are very pronounced, and running your nail over any of the machined parts is very noticable. Looking at kasama/avant heads they are silky smooth and fantastically machined. The bearing tollerences vary alot aswell - but once its all together it appears to work very very well. It would be nice if they took the extra time and just added that last finishing cut to all the parts. It makes such a big difference in my eyes. I woudnt let anything out of my workshop with that sort of finish - for me, its the difference between someone paying me £20 an hour to someone paying me £60 an hour for machining quality.

                            I know my report doesnt sound amasing yet, but i'm sure that will change when I have it flying just as I like it.
                            One thing I will say, that the design and general quality of this heli show's how reliable this machine should be. I cant see having many of the problems Align have with failures.

                            This is my highest end heli I've got - and I really do love it, but I just wanted to point out all the little details I found. Even if I was sponsored by Synergy/Climb-out (which I would love to be!) I would say the same thing. The price of this kit in my eyes is very good for what you get apart from the manual, and I would still recommend it to anyone so far.
                            Sponsored by - Align - CSM Gyro's - OptiFuel/OptiPower - Kontronik Drives UK
                            Align 700E DFC
                            www.robochallenge.co.uk

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by jamiem View Post
                              I did a little playing last night, moved the right hand side ball on the bell/hiller mixing arm out to the outside hole, and instantly gained 2 degrees collective and cyclic. I've mow dialled the rates down a little and the binding is gone in all by the absolute extremes of cyclic with full +ve pitch. I have a feeling that dropping awash by 2 full turns on the lower linkages will solve this, although I ran out of time last night to try. I'm heading tot the field tonight to try it out
                              Jamie, please let us know the final result, I have left mine as per Matt Botos suggestion but I don't feel it is right. Waiting on everyone's findings whilst I get my new engine run in
                              Nick

                              Henseleit TDR 2011 VBar 5.2, Avant Aurora, 700N BeastX, 500 BeastX

                              Member of Byley MFC & South Cheshire HeliAddicts (www.southcheshire.rcheliaddict.co.uk)

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