Can't get the hang of nose in.

[ShinOBIWAN]

Its annoying the hell out of me. I just spaz up and act like I lost 50 IQ points when I see the front of the heli.

I can handle the Blade CX2 nose in pretty good but these give you loads of time to think because they're so easy to fly. Its a different story for regular heli's.

I'm trying a different approach in order to tease my brain into accepting it all. I'm slowly turning the heli very slightly more and more to get used to feel but its like a switch is flipped as soon as it gets even slightly past side in towards the nose.

Attached are a couple of flights I recorded. You'll need to unzip and copy to "My Documents\Phoenix RC\Recordings"

Any tips based on what your seeing? How did you over come this? Any tricks to help with the transition? You'll notice I tease the nose in a few spots but its hard work.

PS. I don't have a copy of Phoenix ATM. I stupidly switched to Realflight and it now won't run on my computer so have another copy of Phoenix in the post. I'll try out any suggestions as soon as I can though. Hate being without a sim.

Thanks

[unwind-protect]

Not that I'm really qualified to comment, but...

I'd pick a less twitchy model, like the trainer. I would (and did!) keep it close in (makes it easier to see what's happening). Practise nose in hover only for a while, using the 'prop up the falling side' technique. When that starts coming together, check you can still hover tail in and side on (you'll probably have forgotten the reflexes...), then try nose in circles around yourself, etc. You'll probably have that feeling of 'nose in switch' for a long time; I still do a bit, a year after mostly cracking it.

I found that flying backwards (as you were trying) introduces an additional level of complexity (namely, heading is no longer the same as the direction the heli is going).

Finally, Phoenix has a 'simulation speed' setting; take it down to 50% and you should be able to nose in and eat lunch at the same time :-)

[ShinOBIWAN]

Thanks I'll give those suggestions a try once I get a chance.

[Twister3D]

When you get your Phoenix up and running, one way is to try doing slow figure 8s, and making the circles bigger then slowing the heli down when its pointing towards you.
I watched your recordings and you have to get the rotor disc level and not add any aileron or elevator when spinning the heli round.
Get the Heli level so its just hanging there with no input on sticks then slowly add rudder and piro the heli all the way around keep spinning all the way untill you feel comfortable and you can slow it down when facing you, doing it a bit higher helps too.

heres a recording to show you my feeble effort

figure_8s_and_piros.zip

[machasm]

Like you, and probably most people, I too was having trouble with nose in.
I think the only way to beat it is to keep at it. Like when you first started to hover tail in that took a while but after a while your reflexes began to fly the heli rather than having to 'think' it.
The same will happen with nose in eventually.
Once you get that sorted you can then start side on after which you go to inverted nose in. Then inverted tail-in and so on and so on.
Big learning curve this flying helis stuff.
Keep at it.
Adrian.

[Boggy]

try the prop it up method!

look at the rotor disc and imagine its a spinning plate now when your nose in if the plate dips in any direction "prop" it up with the right stick! it will soon become second nature and you will find you dont even think about it!

[Mike W]

when i started nose in i used the prop method .. worked a treat .... like n e thing .. the more ya do it the more instinctive it becomes .... til ya try the next new thing ...

[Taffage]

I used the prop it up method too, if the disc tips on the left it goes left, you therefore move the stick to the left and she levels out etc.

[jamiem]

figure of 8's is by far the easiest way. if you tell yourself to prop it up, your having to think about it too much. big open 9's fastish to start, then slow it down and make them more open, it will be much more natural. otherwise you will be having to tell yourself what to do when its nose in, rather than doing it naturally.

[jboweruk]

I've noticed nose in is a soso, as soon as that little Blade (or for that any other heli) on the sim is pointed at me it wants to go past me to be tail in again. I usually get frustrated after a short while and end up doing weird sh** with it until it comes back under control.

[Kwickkwack]

I tend to look at the canopy as much as anything, and picture myself inside it and make corrections from there, dont get me wrong I am no expert, But I can nose in for periods of time until brain fade sets in then I have to change.
Keep practising and one day it will just "click"

[Paul T.]

Just to add my 'haporth to the thread, I learnt nose in some years ago on a Morley MXB (giving away my age here...) by attatching training balls to model, placing model in front of myself nose in and re-learning from the ground up (literally) nose in. Felt totally 'wrong' at first, but after 2/3 tankfuls I was able to take off and land nose in fairly comfortably. (Previously I'd tried all the other methods such as slow 8's etc, but didn't work for me.) Of course this was before heading lock gyros, so the use of one of these would reduce the workload somewhat.

[Radbourne78]

I found learning nose in on the sim really difficult. Doing it for real seemed to work far quicker for me. I found that spinning quickly to nose in - then spinning quickly back to tail if i felt i was loosing it, worked. As long as your comfortable with tail in you can catch whatever mess you just put yourself in. Used this approach with side in too.

[ShinOBIWAN]

Thanks guys.

New copy of Phoenix arrives tomorrow so I'll get on it, see how it goes then let you know what(if anything) works the best for me.

[Made2Fade]

I find its easier when moving forward nose in whilst going round a circuit... then eventually all you do is slow the circuit down so that you fly slowly to nose in and then just hold it. If that makes sense

Cheers
Lee