How close to realistic is it?

[fish6634]

HI all

I have got the lastest version of phoenix and have been practising flying my m130 heli on it. I am going to continue to train for a few weeks before flying the real heli.

My question is how realistic is the sim to the real thing?

I realise there is going to be a difference between the two, i am trying to prepare myself for how much of a difference.

Thanks

Graeme

[Planehazza]

None of them are going to be perfect or lifelike due to lack of depth perception. The physics should be pretty close but you'll find real world models will be setup to different tastes compared to the generic feel on the sim. It will mroe than suffice for training your thumbs and brain. If you can hover in all orientations comfortably and consistently, you'll find it easier in real life once you get past the fear factor and nerves.

[Rachel]

its that real , its been billing your credit card for crash damage !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol
seriously it actually harder than real life but way less expensive!

an awesome learning tool , basically if you can sim it you will be able to fly it !!!!

and with Phoenix , you can create an on line private flyin so you can invite others to see your progress .

:-)
happy flying

[Nick_C]

I wouldn't say pheonix is very realistic at all but great for learning and trying new moves without the damage cost,have flown with real flight 7 and find it more to real life flying,that's just my opinion.

[Supa Koopa]

My question is how realistic is the sim to the real thing?

Answer - Not at all.

I can tic toc an E700 2 inches off the floor all day long on Phoenix, but real life is a different story. Phoenix is just too easy to for my tastes. I prefer Realflight, not because it's better, or the physics are better or any of that bun fighting fuel, just because it's harder to do the things I'm trying to learn.

Treat all sims the same as a learning tool to get your thumbs and brain to work together. Also try fly as you would, learn as you would and save crashes as you would in real life. It's all too easy to give up and crash on the sim as you know a reset is on its way, you wouldn't do that our flying for real so why train yourself to do it on the sim. JMHO

[fish6634]

Treat all sims the same as a learning tool to get your thumbs and brain to work together. Also try fly as you would, learn as you would and save crashes as you would in real life. It's all too easy to give up and crash on the sim as you know a reset is on its way, you wouldn't do that our flying for real so why train yourself to do it on the sim. JMHO

Thats it exactly, at the minute i am not afriad that if i crash (on the sim) i will destroy my heli. I am trying to treat the sim as if i crash my model will be wrecked, but it wont be the same until the real thing i guess, still its a great tool for getting the feel for it

[Leigh Beaumont]

You never get a fear factor with a sim which does not prepare you for the real thing

after I went the simstick route and had to adjust via transmitter mine is now dialed pretty close to flying out doors
like Rachel said flying real thing feels better and I do prefer, trouble is I still won't try half of the stuff I can do on the sim out doors once it feels like normal then I move it out doors but then you have your heart in your mouth those first few times you try that said new move.

remember the sim is your friend and one of the best practise tools out there as crashes cost nothing and it builds muscle memory which you need, there are a lot of very good pilots out there that use the sim loads hence a big reason they got there so fast.

[Varelco]

Its close enough.

Simulators should be used as a tool to help build up your muscle memory, orientations, try out new moves etc. You will be endlessly tweaking and trying to gain the right 'feel' on a simulator so its seems more realistic but there isn't really any benefit to it.

Helicopters in the real world and simulators fly differently to each other, trying to adapt to one particular feel isn't going to do you any favours.

[tomatwalden]

As others have said - it's realistic up to a point, but a sim cannot give you that fear factor of flying a real heli. Stuff that's easy on the sim suddenly becomes 10 times harder when the consequences are a smashed heli, time spent repairing it and the cost of buying replacement parts.

[Peteski]

Its close enough.
Helicopters in the real world and simulators fly differently to each other, trying to adapt to one particular feel isn't going to do you any favours.

I'm new to all this too and have been using the sim for a few weeks (neXt in my case). The different models available in the sim fly quite differently, so I've just been using lots of them to get a feel for differences e.g. different sizes, power etc. But they all use the same muscle memory at the end of the day. Just different rates of response etc. I'm sure real helis are no different in this respect. Perhaps an analogy would be driving different cars. Although the feel can be quite different, once you can drive one car you can drive pretty much any car.

[Peteski]

As others have said - it's realistic up to a point, but a sim cannot give you that fear factor of flying a real heli. Stuff that's easy on the sim suddenly becomes 10 times harder when the consequences are a smashed heli, time spent repairing it and the cost of buying replacement parts.

It's the same with race car sims. You can lap Monaco pretty quick on a professional F1 sim with a bit of practice, but you certainly wouldn't be able to in real life

[Cagey]

This is and will continue to be a contentious subject till sims advance enormously. They are very much person specific, in my case I find Phoenix completely unrealistic, to such an extent that it can lull you into a false sense of "can do'ability" too easily.Then when you fly for real,it's so simple to be tempted into what often is a disaster when you're learning. They are helpful regards orientation, hand eye co-ordination, general heli response to control inputs, also good fun.
But realistic ? Far from it buddy.

[fish6634]

i have taken on board the comments and have come up with the conclusion that they are great for practice and getting the feel of things, i certainly wont be doing stunts anytime soon but for getting the feel of hovering and orientation they seem good. i guess the only way to get the feel for outside flying is try outside fly haha

great responses everyone thank you

[myxiplx]

Phoenix isn't that realistic, but in all honesty it will take you at least a year of practising on it before you get good enough to spot the weaknesses. I've moved up to AccuRC and a Trex 250 and retired Phoenix this year, but I put in a *lot* of time on Phoenix, I was flying 60-90 minutes a day for 9 months.

Once you get to the stage you're flying a lot of 3D Phoenix starts to show it's weaknesses, but even then it's still good enough for getting your head around the orientations and learning the basics. Early on I found that practising on a sim and a micro was a great way to build skills, and everything I'd learnt translated straight to my 600N.

To begin with try to use the sim as a tool rather than a game. Some good tips would be:
- Set a 4-5 min timer on your transmitter and practice landing when the alarm goes off. It'll give you landing practice, and get you used to flying a few minutes at a time as you will in real life.
- Each time you load the sim, have a practice routine in mind, and stick to that for the first few minutes. I'll typically do the repetitive practice for the first 10-15 mins and then relax for a bit.
- Work on orientations, practice hovering the helicopter in all 4 basic directions (tail in, nose left, nose right, nose in), and once you crack those try the 45 degree ones too.
- In Phoenix, turn on the F3C box, try to hover inside the box and land on the circle. Then try to land on the circle in different orientations.

Also, Phoenix and other sims often fly better with larger models. Don't be afraid to try out a larger heli, the reflexes you learn will still translate just as well :-)

[hedge]

One other point to add to those above is sims become more useful as you progress. Depending on how fast you learn there can become a lull in your sim use where you feel it's unreal and while you can fly all sorts of manouvers in the sim when you get to the field you are back to upright circuits with the odd flip or roll. If your at this point as said above limit what you do in the sim to the new move you want to achieve at the field. My rule of thumb is when I stip crashing the move in the sim it's time to do it for real.