Good suggestion for those who cant afford phoenix etc

[andylinney]

Garthy,

It's a fair point in some respects - this is an expensive hobby and a decent simulator can save you money in the long run - I've spent £100's on spares since getting started and as a long time plane flier I can empathise with wanting to dedicate money to getting an actual heli in the air asap.

I guess what people have been trying to say is that we've seen lots and lots of people come along and go and spend what is in all reality a lot of money on getting started only to give up after a few setbacks and expensive crashes. A sim (especially a good one) can dramatically reduce your likelihood of stuffing the heli in within a few days of getting going.

The money spent on a sim will quickly be offset against the cost of spares for those tentative first few hops. Having someone willing to help is a great asset to getting going but it's unfair to depend on them entirely during their time at the field.

It did in all fairness read not too well, but in some respects it was only intended as a piece of guidance based on those peoples experiences, as you'll know from flying planes, crashes can be major setbacks, not just financially but also confidence wise also, the sim can help alleviate that risk to some extent. My experience so far has shown that a sim has proved invaluable and when pitched against the others, Pheonix is actually one of the cheapest and best value offerings on the market - good luck with your flying and dependant on where in scotland you are I hope to see you at a fly-in soon!


Andy

[DemonJim]

The thing here is people are strongly recommending Phoenix as an early purchase out of bitter experience - I for one wish I'd bought it sooner than I did.

It's a real shame it doesn't have a playable demo for people to see quite why it's so good so they can be sure it's worth the investment (and that they are sure they want to get into the hobby) - go to a model shop and ask for a go of it, you'll love it.

I think the point Smoothound was really making is that if you are going to invest in a half-decent collective pitch heli you can't afford NOT to get Phoenix, as without it learning will actually cost more in the long run.

[Mike W]

I actually started to fly before I bought a sim ....After some advice from the people on here .... I bought Phoenix , glad i did ... its soo realistic its too cool... Have tried alot of the free sims and nothing comapares to it ... One thing the free sims do do like most is it gives ya an idea of the stick movements .... But if ya think ya gonna use a free sim then try to fly forget it ....I also was flying planes for a few months before going the heli route .... Its been fun to say the least .. Have had numerous crashes and wrote both planes and helis off .... Each time i do i just laff and fly again ... Half the fun is in the crashing lol ....

[Smoothound]

It gets you to Mill Hill and the Heli field so it's not all bad

Exactly my point

[Garthy]

Im hearing you its all good there is a demo for phoenix for all who wanna look its here:

http://www.phoenix-sim.com/demo.htm

yeah it looks awesome

[cambs flyer]

Trust me Garthy if you want to fly the big stuff without the outlay of crash and learning damage, Phoenix is the way to go.

Don't think for a minute you won't have a blast because you will, and the sim demo doesn't display the true graphical nature and what can be done within it.

I still enjoy flying my Phoenix Sim even though I'm flying the real thing now.

If it takes you a little longer to get there don't worry bud', that can be a blessing as well, says he who amassed 120 hours of Phoenix sim time before his very first 450 lift off.

[cjcj1949]

I think there's another point to be made. Arguments (discusions) on all forums, get out of hand as soon as anyone gives an opinion on anything. I've been flying models for too many years and sims would have saved me lots of crashes. Sims give you the opportunity to get in lots of low cost practice, the better the sim the closer to reality, but and its a big but, they don't prepare you for the situation when you suddenly realise that it's real and it's all down to you to keep it in the air. I went completely blank even though in theory I knew what I was doing, so you never now how you will react until you're looking at the bits, or you're saying "That was close".

That brings me on to the other extreme kind of crash where you get overconfident and try to do something that's beyond your current ability. Then of course there's the change in weather and all the various faults that can develop, or simple omissions like forgetting to extend the tx aerial.

What I'm trying to say is that crashing is inevitable, as everybody else has said, sims can reduce the probability of a crash, but only if they don't give a new pilot false confidence. I think it's always a good idea to have an experienced flyer check out and take the first flight. It's more fun to do it all on your own, but helis are far too easy to damage and really the more help you can get the better. I don't think anyone's mentioned training undercarraiges, but in my experience they are even more necessary than a good sim.

I recently bought clearview largely for the cx2, then I started to use it for single rotor helis but even though I haven't yet flown a real heli I could see that a lot of things were too easy, like takeoff and landing on grass, and others were just wrong with the cx2 gliding effortlessly over grass as though it were a smooth surface. So, and thanks to much of the comments on this forum, I've ordered the Phoenix sim.

I hope to be able to fly a real heli soon, but if I keep crashing on the sim I'll have to stick to the cx2.

The point I'm trying to make is that crashing is about attitude. If you are very cautious and proceed slowly with lots of practice then you can avoid crashing. Very few, if any, can be cautious all the time so you have to budget for the repairs. As someone at our club said 'If you can't afford to crash it, then don't fly it'.

I think everybody has been saying the same thing and very few modellers are elitist. Most are more impressed by how you fly, rather than how much you spend.

[lbl25a]

OK I have done it, on all your recommendations I have now bought and tried Phoenix and compared this with HeliSimRC. I grant you that Phoenix is a really great simulator, but I don't have to worry about finding the money for my hobbies!
To get back to the point made in the original post - is HeliSimRC a reasonable alternative to Phoenix for those on a budget?.
If you are a beginner starting on the cheap with small electric helicopters and already have a suitable USB controller or cable, then I would say that it is worth trying at least until you have cracked hovering with an FP or CP electric. For those who can afford it Phoenix is definitely worth the money but to be honest HeliSimRC gives almost as realistic simulation of small elecric indoor helicopters and should get the beginner to the hovering stage as well as Phoenix would.

[liambaker996]

I see the points of view but people used to learn without sims so im sure we can carry on doing it, I find it a bit unfair to discourage people from joining the hobby because they cant afford the extra £100 for a sim, I would have thought this forum would be here to encourage everyone of all walks of like wanting to look into this hobby just my tuppence and i think almost everyone will agree with that in one way or another :-) anyway cheer up and look to the skys for fun

[Mark_T]

Spend the money on a good sim or spend the same or more on crash repairs, but you will spent it one way or another.

Everyone is free to make their own choice but I know which I'd rather spend it on

[Smoothound]

Spend the money on a good sim or spend the same or more on crash repairs, but you will spent it one way or another.

Everyone is free to make their own choice but I know which I'd rather spend it on

It's not hard to guess which will cost you more in the long run is it

[NoFlyZone]

My thoughts, a hobby, any hobby is going to cost money be it flying RC helis or stamp collecting it is going to cost.
buying a sim (pheonix or the competitions make) is going to teach you the basics, stick movemnt, hovering etc and can be had for £75-80.
your TX is negligable as you ARE going to need a TX to fly RC helis so this cost cancels itself out (if you see my point)
Ok, you dont want to spend £80 on a sim, fine your choice you go and learn with your heli in some field and I will garauntee within 5mins you walking back with a mashed heli or worst. So you rebuild it and try again, you can bet on the same scenario as the first, and so on you try you fail you rebuild and try again.
Now if you have the patience of a saint and deep pockets you will eventually fly, but your first flight an crash cost you 40-50 quid, your second the same, has not the Sim paid for itself by now hopefully teaching you the basics without extra cost.

but you pays your money and takes your choice..

whichever way you go....Enjoy!!

[Paulo uk]

Just wish it was Mac friendly...
BTW: anybody running it on Parallels?? {please say there is lol]

I run this on parallels with no problem whatsoever, bt I have got a serious Mac (quad core, 8gb ram etc etc..) cant see why it wouldn't work well on a lesser mac in bootcamp!?!?!?!?


Paul

[barryorbik]

I read all the forumsadvice about starting out but set my budget to £250.00 for my trial of this hobby. I bought Pheonix and an RTF Honey Bee King 2, as the parts were cheap. A major problem that showed up immediately was that my only computer is a pretty well spec'd and fairly new HP laptop but it seems that the inbuilt graphics cards are pretty poor, so screen freezing and random delayed action to input commands resulted. Because of these problems and despite the vain attempts of many 'computer experts' my Pheonix is rarely used these days. I installed FMS which came with the King 2 and more recently Helisim, which is much better than FMS but feel I have learned quicker and enjoyed my practice more with my Blade MSR. Ok it won't do inverted or tick tocks etc etc but it has raised my skill levels to being competant in taking off, landings, nose in orientation and basic circuits etc without major great costs.

I personally find that flying something - even with all the attendant breakage risks, is a far better and quicker route than watching a 1D simulation on a 15.4" laptop screen.

But whatever your choice is - have fun

Barry

[spukemonkey]

i learnt to fly witout a sim..the scare factor keeps me in check...my first flight cost me a new set of skids...main thing i broke is tail booms lol but £5 a time (4 tail boom...2 main shafts..1 tail boom support...not bad for over a yr witout a sim) but.... i would hav used a sim if it wasnt so exspensive... "To be honest if you can't afford Phoenix you can't afford to fly RC Helis, it's that simple" i cant afford it, but i like flying them...i sold off my fishin gear for this hobby cus my bad back aint gettin ne better..i dont drink or smoke..i break it i save up n wait but it dont make me not want to fly...all i got is a twister cp gold...not the best nor the worst heli but it flys....after all its hobby not a owners club comparing how much they have spent

"A hobby is an activity or interest that is undertaken for pleasure or relaxation"

nuff said