Good suggestion for those who cant afford phoenix etc

[Eddie]

I think you are missing the point Phil. I accept we are all entitled to voice our views and opinions. However, I would have thought someone with your so called heli knowledge, experience and respect for the hobby this would be the last thing you would suggest,
“To be honest if you can't afford Phoenix you can't afford to fly RC Helis, it's that simple”
Simple for you maybe but don’t forget there are many other’s out there that are not as fortunate as you, or maybe they are! Garthy was merely pointing out there are alternatives to the Phoenix sim.

[Mike W]

Yes there are alternates to Phoenix sim but then when ya start the heli up and it does not behave like the sim and ya end up crashing alll the time then Phoenix has paid for itself after ya first crash if its a nitro ... Me i went the other way and learnt to fly an elec first ... then got phoenix .. Best thing i evere did .... AS for the money side of it ... This is the good thing with this hobby .... we are from all walks of life ... As for flying ... I personally like the 30 size and above nitro's and to get one up and running with pretty decent gear ya looking at £700-1200 for a 30/50 machine ... To do 3D ya talking alot more ...As for other sims ... i cant see n e thing wrong in them as they give ya some idea of the sticks without the need for a pay for sim so good luck to em ... But it ya really wanna learn then to spend on Phoenix and a TX will set ya back a few hundred quid to see if ya like it or not , if ya dont then ya aint gonna waste money by crashing all the time ...

[Smoothound]

Pretty much like Mike says to be honest.

Helis aren't a cheap hobby full stop.

If you are trying to do it on the cheap you are on a hiding to nothing and would be better off looking for a a cheaper hobby, possibly one within your financial constraints

As it appears I'm being targeted as a filthy rich, "elitest" Heli flyer nothing could be further from the truth. I buy the best stuff I can and go without other things like flash cars, houses etc. Many come on here and say they can only afford to spend £100 on a heli but would quite happily **** the same up against a wall over every weekend at a club and consider that was money well spent

[Garthy]

Wow im sorry guys didn't mean to start such an emotive subject, i just thing all the points of view here are correct but fact of the matter buying phoenix on top of a heli will cost a lot of money i prefer to buy the kit and use the cheap sim to learn basic stick controls and let my friend help teach me with the real flying, yeah the sims may not act like the real thing (No sim no matter how expensive ever will) but they do teach you movements of the sticks and heli etc, plus i flew planes a lot when i was younger never once got told then buy the expensive sim or dont bother getting into the hobby im just surprised that seems to be the feeling of a lot of people. Guess ill leave you guys to it as ill be moving away from this forum with the attitude thats being presented im just shocked never thought i would come up against a brick wall like this when trying to get into a hobby good luck all and good bye cause you dont seem to want to encourage people into the hobby with whats being said, very dissapointed :-(. (Atleast not everyone was negative cheers to the people that weren't)

RCHeliaddict - not so friendly it seems

[marktigere1]

Nah, don't mind them.

I started in 1998 with a Futaba 154 Gyro, a Shuttle, Contest 10 fuel and no sim. All the things you shouldn't have apparently.

Today, after a 5 year break, I still have no sim and use Model Technics ProPower fuel which again is what you shouldn't do apparently.

Just progress at your own pace, enjoy the hobby and don't leave the forum.

It is a friendly place, really

Cheers

Mark

[Mike W]

We all have a point of view .. Would be a very dull world if we did not .. As for an elitist hobby it is not ... Expensive yes ... BUT it all depends whether u want to spend the amount of money some of us spend at it ... Yes you can spend £260 on a blade 400 and no sim ... NOW think of it this way ... The amount of crashes and spares you will need it you dont use a sim to learn on ... Someone on here did nothing but sim time for ages before he flew .. When he did it was easier and he lasted longer before he crashed.. We all crash at some point or other ... Now that can cost ya n e thing from £30 - £200 depending on the heli...We are not TELLING you to buy the sim . .WE are advising that to get n e where the level that ya aint gonna be crashing all the time is to spend that little extra on a good sim ... Phoenix being the best for helis there is ..As for leaving that is entirely down to you ....We also encourage people to get into the hobby and to realise that pitfalls of it ....And like Mark said ... the choice is always yours ... Me one of my helis most people hate ... me i love the thing as i can throw it around without having to worry if i break it or not hehe ... Wife told me no more helis till i kill the ones i got ... Well apart from the 2 new ones i buying soon lol l......I got an understanding wife heh

[Smoothound]

Garthy,

It's not a brick wall or carved in stone, just the truth in my opinion after a few years of playing the game

No Sim is perfect, no matter what they tell you on here about Phoenix, in reality it's no better or worse than Reflex or Realflight. At the end of the day the main idea is to learn the stick movements but you are far better of using ONE of the better quality Sims than the free ones IMHO because they are far more real.

At the end of the day it's your money your choice do what you feel is best for you. Too often people come on ask a question get advice then go and do their own thing and 5 mins later they are back on asking the same thing again but £££'s worse off.

Pay your money take your choice

I was not having a go at you, just more annoyed with the comments about me being rich and elitist by someone who has only been a member for 5 minutes

[Mike W]

I would be rich if i did not do this hobby

[Garthy]

Just seems that the basic response was buy the sim or dont bother getting into the hobby then everyone went on to agree to me thats a very snobbish atttitude im sure you can see my point of view on that well ill just shut up know i dont wanna get into arguments on here after all im the new guy but surely you can see that what was said in reply to a helpful thread would get my back up when ive only just come here would be like trying to join a golf club but only being allowed in if i have a ferrari bad attitude i feel

Phil i think that as an active member in this community you should have a look back at the begginin of the thread and just imagine what someone whos thinking of getting into the hobby thinks when they read this

"To be honest if you can't afford Phoenix you can't afford to fly RC Helis, it's that simple"

not really encouraging it really does come across as elitist, ill hang around im just throwing my teddy lol after what i thought was some really negative reactions to a suggestion good luck all with the flying weathers getting better here in the UK now yippeeee

[Eddie]

Garthy,

It's not a brick wall or carved in stone, just the truth in my opinion after a few years of playing the game

No Sim is perfect, no matter what they tell you on here about Phoenix, in reality it's no better or worse than Reflex or Realflight. At the end of the day the main idea is to learn the stick movements but you are far better of using ONE of the better quality Sims than the free ones IMHO because they are far more real.

At the end of the day it's your money your choice do what you feel is best for you. Too often people come on ask a question get advice then go and do their own thing and 5 mins later they are back on asking the same thing again but £££'s worse off.

Pay your money take your choice

I was not having a go at you, just more annoyed with the comments about me being rich and elitist by someone who has only been a member for 5 minutes

Well, Phil as you were obviously aiming your comment at me.
Your true colours are really shining. I suggest you take a minute to reflect on what you said and how new 5 minute members like myself have reacted. All the same part of this supposedly quote: “Friendly RC Helicopter Community” are we!
The point which you have forgotten is you are talking personnel rather than general and the fact is like thousands of heli enthusiasts they will probably never attempt the standard or level you guys are probably at, but merely enjoy flying Helis with or without Phoenix and interacting with forums, comments and information which might be useful to someone on a particular skill or even budget.
Please don’t tar every one with your initial comment.
Remember as a learner Pilot. You used to be one once! like me.
PS You're initial comment was elitist, whether you like it or not.

[Smoothound]

Whatever, if you read through most people on the thread agreed so I rest my case. Of course you know better as you are obviously better informed than me so i'll not comment any more

[Smoothound]

I would be rich if i did not do this hobby

Too right. I'd have a big flash car and not a crappy old P reg Astra Van as well

[Rat]

Tried FMS. It was easy! Suspiciously so, at which point following the advise here, I went for phoenix (I figured worst case I could resell it for minimal loss). 10 or so dead sim helis later, I twigged that things were not quite as simple.

Following a couple of months on the sim, I came across a heli that ticked all the boxes second hand. Once gyro settings were sorted on that, the remarkable thing is it feels almost exactly the same as in phoenix. Wind drift, the corrections required on takeoff. I can guarantee to myself that without that sim practice, and the advice from this forum, I would have one dead Esky Belt-CP right now.

The advice offered, by the above posters, I feel stems much from personal experience and attempting to prevent others from repeating the same mistakes over and over again. Doesn't mean there isn't an element of fun in learning the hard way

[cambs flyer]

I don't think theres and given rule to how you enjoy heli flying, someone may be satisfied with bombing a BCX2 and various Contras around the house and that's enough for them.

Other's fancy taking it a stage further and buy a machine that can fly outside in the wind, unlike the Contra's.

Both are just fine, so long as your getting enjoyment that's all that matters.

For me having spent months on Phoenix going onto a Trex 450 was terrifying to begin with, but I knew what I was doing only confidence needed rebuilding as having the real thing hovering five feet from you is quite intimidating, then again I was intimidated by the BCX2 after jumping from one of those foam 2ch flyers.

I'd say the best heli you can fly is the one you can fly the most regardless of size or type.

FMS can be classed as better than nothing, it will teach the cyclic flight and rudder, throttle control but not very realistically.

But enough to give the beginner an idea how difficult it is to learn and that FMS even though it's a freebie isn't giving you the whole truth just how tricky this game is.

Thanks to Phoenix it cost me less in crashes to learn the basics with a 450 then it did with the CX2 indoors via learning from physical mistakes

What is heartbreaking is the amount of flyer's who possibly give up due to not enough training, or have brought sub standard equipment, I'm not elitist, Christ just look at my list of gear, but mistakes no matter how much good will there is to start with often put people right off.

I'm sure some of the cheaper sims offer a little to help the flyer go for a real outside class machine, but those must tread much more carefully and take it very slowly.

In this hobby theres something for everyone, and I'm sure most of the info on offer here was written out of bitter sweet experiences learning the hard way, but if the will is there and the passion to excel, anyone will get there eventually.

OK Phoenix is a big plus and if you can afford it great! but if you can't and can only afford modest priced equipment the best thing really is join a local club and let the lads taim your machine and give valuable first hand knowledge and encouragement

[Leebert]

Too right. I'd have a big flash car and not a crappy old P reg Astra Van as well

It gets you to Mill Hill and the Heli field so it's not all bad