shakein thar ass

[reg]

hi there,iv just got my 450 v2 running with the 401 and 9257 tail servo the gain is on 0 and the gyro is set so when i move the rudder to the right the tail stays to the right,i set the tail in the center and as i spool up and get to near take off the tail starts to wobble and the tail servo goes mad to try and counter it,iv not gone past this point as i dont want to damage anything,iv got the heli so its light on the skids and the front is solid but the tail wags like a dog,iv looked in the search but cant find anything
thanks
mark

[jamiem]

for a start it sounds like the rudder direction on your transmitter is wrong. when moving the stick to the right, the nose should swing right. Id start with your avcs gain at about 50%. I assume the gyro is being started in HH? (red light on, not blinking?). If when you take off it wants to wildly piro round on itself, then you have the sensing direction on the gyro set the wrong way.

[reg]

thanks mate i will nip out and have a go

[reg]

hi jamiem,the tail is the right way,i move the stick left and the tail moves right,where do i adjust the avcs gain,i got it in the air,it hold still then will woble hold woble hold woble,also the motor when i hover pulses

[Taffage]

hi jamiem,the tail is the right way,i move the stick left and the tail moves right,where do i adjust the avcs gain,i got it in the air,it hold still then will woble hold woble hold woble,also the motor when i hover pulses

If the tail is wagging then the gain is too high, on futaba transmitters you want around 32%.

[chugga-bug]

also the motor when i hover pulses

That shouldn't happen!

Check your gear mesh. Have you got a tight spot?
You need to set the mesh with a tiny bit of play at the tightest spot on the main gear.
Also what head speed are you running?
The higher the speed the more tail authority you'll have.

[reg]

hi there chugga-bug thanks for the reply,i think the pulsing might have been the battery getting low as i went back out after writing the post,did a hover and the head speed went down,i will see what it does tomorrow on a full battery,iv got my hed speed at 0-0 2-50 3-80 4-90 5-100,iv got the mesh as you sugested,i looked at the gyro sense on my handset (dx7)and it was 50 iv put it on 72,i will look tomorrow if its done any good,
also when i set the pitch,it says to do 0 40 45 50,to get -2 -1 zero,but for me to get that i have to set it at 0 20 25 50,does this matter
thanks
mark

[reg]

iv just had a go in the front room and the tail is much more stable with 72 than it was with 50 on the gyro setting,
mark

[SimonN]

Mark,

I don't mean to be funny mate, but have you not got someone who can look over the heli before you fly it again? I say that because there are a few things that you have typed that are worrying me!

Starting with the gyro problem... In your first post you say you have the gain set at 0, this would mean that you have no hold and the last thing you would get it tail wag. Then you say you have it at 50 and have upped it to 72 and it's better! Upping the gain would normally make your problem worse not better. Are you sure you have the gyro gain in the right channel? If it's not you may have the gain at 100% because it could be the using the "end point" of whichever channel it's plugged into.

Head speed and pulsing motor.... You shouldn't let your battery get that flat. Lipos don't like been run right down.

And your pitch curve... Hmmmm.. I'm confused. A linear pitch curve of 0,25,50,75,100 should give you about -11 to +11 pitch range. If you need to use "0 20 25 50" your mechanical setup is way out. 50% should give you 0 degrees of pitch so about 70 should have you hovering at about 5 degrees of pitch. To keep it simple for now, set up a straight pitch curve of 0,25,50,75,100. Then put the stick in the middle (i.e. 50) and adjust your linkages so that you have 0 degrees of pitch. Then try a pitch curve in "normal" (opposed to idle up/stunt) of about 30,45,60,75,90 (play with these figures slightly, I'm sure somebody with a T-rex will jump in here!).

That's a start....

Simon

[richieclarkie]

Hi Reg

A few pointers that may help.

If you were running the Gyro Sense Menu, then 50 is a transition between rate mode and HH (AVCS) mode, it would have been confusing the gyro. Hence why things improved when you brought it up to 72.

Personally I would disable the gyro page and set the gear channel (assuming the gain is plugged into gear) to +55 and -45 as a starting point. You will then be able to switch between rate and HH modes easily.
I assume you have set your limits up correctly and there is no binding, but you have full travel on the tail shaft?

Simon is right of course on the Lipo thing, I'm sure you are aware you have to be VERY careful running them down. If you ran it to the point where the headspeed really dropped, you may have damaged your pack. At worse you can make it unstable which could cause you a bit of a problem like a fire. I'm sure you know all this anyway and it just came accross wrong in your post.

On TH and Pitch curves I would be tempted to setup the following:
TH 0 75 75 75 75
Pitch 0 25 50 75 100
In the Swash mix reduce the pitch to a sensible amount that you feel comfortable with I would start at 60% and see.

If you are flying with idle ups then set 80 80 80 80 80 in idel 1 and 90 90 90 90 90 in Idle 2.

In my opinion the V2s work best with a reasonable headspeed. Too low and they are harder to fly.

[reg]

thanks SimonN,thanks for that,iv got someone who will look at it now you have said for me to,i will have a better read through what you have said tomorrow as im half a sleep,
thanks for your time
mark

richieclarkie,you just posted the same time as me so thankyou aswell im just going to have a read now
thanks
mark

[reg]

thanks SimonN and richieclarkie,iv had a read,i will have a look at changing things tomorrow,as you can see im a newb,i will let the chap i know have a look at it but i dont think he would know half the stuff you chaps have sugested,i go to an indoor heli club and we are all newbs,its caose,its a shame there isnt a club near leicestershire that i could go to have a good look and exsplaine what they are doing,
thanks
mark

[wazzer]

Reg

Im just building and Setting up a 450se V2 for a mate and i can highly recommend watching the finless Build videos over on heli freak its really worth the effort it will explain allot about everything from setting up the DX7 to understanding CCPM and the all important how to set up the Gryo. The vids are not all specific to the 450 se V2 but there are plenty that are specific to the 450 in general and the 450 SE V1 watch everything you can download you will learn loads. Also don't forget the set up forum on this site also lots of valuable information on gyro set up, Pitch and throttle curves.

Also i have set up the DX7 and GY401 combo by following the instructions on raptor technique ( http://www.raptortechnique.com/gy401-dx7.htm )and it works a treat for me. Using the gear channel and the endpoints to adjust the Gain. Dont forget Futaba and JR (DX7 is basically JR TX) use different techniques for setting gyro gain, the JR equivalent value is normally much higher than the Futaba.

I have learnt to build and fly helis just by reading and asking question in the various forums on the net and i am now at a stage where i am building helis for people with much greater flying experience than myself and they are very pleased with the way the helis i build fly.

Be patient read read and read some more there is a wealth of information available especially detailed info for the Align Trex 450 series

its a fascinating hobby and you will learn a huge amount just dont rush your self.

A well set up heli is a joy to fly not a battle!

Good luck and enjoy the learning process

Keep us posted on your progress i am just learning to spot land and side in hover

Cheers

Ben

[reg]

thanks wazzer,they were the ones i followed,i think i will have another look

[SimonN]

Re: pitch curve

Ritchieclarke has said

"On TH and Pitch curves I would be tempted to setup the following:
TH 0 75 75 75 75
Pitch 0 25 50 75 100
In the Swash mix reduce the pitch to a sensible amount that you feel comfortable with I would start at 60% and see."

I know why he is saying this but personally that wouldn't be my advice (sorry Ritchie ). Firstly you need to get the mechanical setup right before you worry about anything else. The problem with using Ritchies curve as a newbie (sorry, hate to use that term but couldn't think what else to put!!) is that you will have the same amount of negative pitch as you will positive. You can adjust the swash mix so that you only have 8 or 9 degs of +ve pitch but this also means that you will have 8 or 9 degs of -ve pitch. Now that in itself is fine but that's not what you need when you're learning - closing the thottle on a bit of a panic will see the heli descend a bit quicker than you would like
I would still advise setting the lowest point on the pitch curve at about 30 and going up from there. That way you will still have a bit of negative pitch (3 degs is about right) when the throttle is closed so you can get the heli down easier but not too much that you have the heli bouncing up and down as you try to maintain a hover. When you've got it sussed then use Ritchies curve in idle up (or "stunt mode") and go for it!

Good advice from Ritchie and Wazzer on the gyro bit...

Simon