RCHA Membership Declined :-(

[ChrisB]

Agreed I fully support them that's my personal choice though

And that's why it's there.

[Skipper Billy]

Has anyone spoken to the SAA (Scottish Aeromodellers Association) ?? They appear to have achieved what the RCHA desires - a working partnership whereby 'another' schemes insurance, achievement scheme etc is recognised ??

I beleive the LMA has also achieved something similar??

If my memory is correct and the above is true it kind rains on the parade of the 'monopoly' theory but potentially opens a door to achieve a solution.

The contact deatils of the SAA are here - Council Members

There is nothing to stop anyone joining the SAA - you dont have to live in Scotland, or be a ginger, or have blue skin or wear a kilt when you are flying!!! I joined largely as a protest at the cack-handed way the BMFA do things - they have ideas way above their station and generally behave like spoiled kids in my experience.

The only downside for me is that I can no longer advertise things for sale on the BMFA forum which I used quite a lot

[LipolyGone]

Agreed I fully support them that's my personal choice though

And that's why it's there.

Do you fully support what this forum does for the heli community though chris?
Not having a pop at you personaly but the very reason why Stuart could not get 500 people
is sitting in your hands & everyone elses hands who continue to use the forum without wanting
to help its originator change the future of the sport for what could be a very positive position for us.
I supported the RCHA as a fully insured member in 2010 I also had to join the bmfa so I could fly at charmouth
which I happily did. Now if it were to be turned around & you didnt need the bmfa insurance option I'm sure we
wouldnt be in the position were in here now with alot of people not having insurance & also not being able to get the
bmfa on the phone to renew
It was so easy to pay via the internet for rcha insurance & be insured straight away yet the bmfa fail to give us this easy option.

[mattydred]

Do you fully support what this forum does for the heli comunity though chris?

obviously he doesnt

[ChrisB]

Do you fully support what this forum does for the heli community though chris?

Yes hence why I am a site sponsor,I also support what the bmfa does for the heli fliers too.

How can I buy rcha insurance when dmhc members need to be bmfa registered as does my other club I fly at,as does my local council where I fly on odd occasion.

[Baldie]

obviously he doesnt

Trouble with comments like this, And not having a pop at anyone, is that this forum is the face of the RHCA.

would you want to attend a RCHA fly in after being slated on here? Not sure I would.

Anyone wanting to investigate joining the RHCA will end up on this forum and read what is written. Then make their own mind up.

I am not surprised that 500 members couldnt be reached. Logistically It just seems unattainable.

Think of all the heli flyers you know. Now add to that all the famous names from the uk. Then at the busiest time on here add all the members logged on from the list on the right.

I would be surprised if you could make 500.

I think the main problem is that heli flyers are in the minority anyway and this is where the problem lies.

Hats off to Stuart for what he is trying to do, But its not a job i would want to take on.

Just my 2p

[frog]

I don't get the problem.

If you join one of the BMFA's clubs why moan that you need to be a BMFA member? If you scuba dive, you cannot join a BSAC club without being a BSAC member. Same thing.

A club chooses to be a BMFA club, just as it can choose to be non-BMFA if the members so wish it. This is choice! Or you can not be in a club at all. Similarly, why go to one of their events if you are so against them? The RCHA could do exactly the same if it had it's own events.

Just because the BMFA have a long history and are well established does not mean that this situation is unfair. A competitor has it's work cut out but that does not make it unfair. It's like setting up shop selling TVs and then moaning that Currys have a monopoly.

Clearly not enough people chose the alternative this time. Thats all there is to it.

[Stuart]

BUT (and its a big but!), if you do that, you can't call the BMFA up if you have flying site issues (for example), you won't be able to enter BMFA events, and perhaps most importantly, you won't have the clout of over 30,000 members behind you when it comes time to negotiate the insurance terms.

As someone once said, if you owe the bank £100, that's YOUR problem. If you owe them £1million, its THEIR problem!

30,000+ members carries a lot more clout than 500, when negotiating with the "powers that be"!

Pete

I have already stated that I didn't want this to turn into a BMFA slagging match - but your statements are misleading I know how much the BMFA paid for cover and ours was tbh not that far off but the fact ours was more robust. (Claims Occuring versus Claims Made - highlights this point more so)

Plus the difference in members doesn't make a difference to the CAA or Ofcom.

I quote from contacts within the CAA.

It is often thought that the CAA has formal agreements with the BMFA and other organisations that represent individuals in the aviation industry. In actual fact there is no formal agreement . As you can imagine there are very many clubs, organisations and representative bodies covering aviation in the country but it is simply not practical for the CAA to contact every one individually.

Whenever the CAA pursues a change to the law we are required by Government to consult with the public. Consultations are publicised on our website and often via press releases which may be published in the relevant media. RCHA is of course welcome to respond to the consultation and your comments will be considered equally alongside comments put forward by other organisations and individuals.

The bottom line the BMFA didn't provide any supporting information for the statement it produced earlier in the year that would enable us to work towards a mutually beneficial solution. The fact that the statement put obsticles in the way for members to decided which cover they wanted and the lack of any repsonse made it impossible for us to really pin down a solution.

We have been extremely open with our insurers on the issue and they asked a minimum. Now when we have said minimum members which I don't foresee being too long we will put the cover back into our member pack.

People as far as I'm concerned will see in the longer run which body wants to support its members with not just the CAA & Ofcom issues which in reality are background aspects. But more of who is working to highlight the hobby show its merits and expands its horizons beyond just the fraternity and grow the hobby for all not just for a small element.

We knew and still know how many fly what disciplines (3D - Sport - F3C) - the BMFA doesn't

We know how many fly fixed wing or heli or glider - the BMFA doesn't

For years the BMFA has known that it doesn't know this information about its members and still hasn't done anything about it.

We understand our members much better in my view because we are open to ideas and will listen. We have a purpose and vision for the future and know where we are heading towards.

Listen, its christmas and all I want to do now its enjoy time with my kids and family and we are still walking very much with purpose and vision.

[davew]

I've posted on the subject before, like most of you have and to me the situation is simple:

BMFA insurance is universally accepted. RCHA isn't. They are the same price. My club requires BMFA.

I think it unfortunate that there is a move by some to place everyone in one camp or the other. That's just divisive and achieves nothing.

We are all in the same camp. We are all heli flyers and its right that we should stick together. The RCHA in trying to persuade us all to leave the BMFA and join the RCHA was always a non starter.

I've said before, I'm very happy to pay a subscription of some sort to the RCHA that would go towards promoting the hobby but not prepared to burn my bridges with the BMFA or to pay two organisations for the same thing (the validiy of which is dubious anyway).

Good luck to Stuart though in his ongoing efforts to take the sport forward. I do sincerely appreciate his efforts but urge him to redirect them slightly.

[waveydavey]

i will have insurance

£5 million public liability insurance cover for all of your flying or otherwise, at home or in Europe.
£15.50
Full 12 month membership with insurance cover
1st August 2010 to
31st July 2011

That's as maybe, and my comment wasn't really pointed at you directly. However, with the above insurance you can't attend and fly at any of the superb flyins throughout the year. Worth joining the BMFA just for that in my opinion.

Pete, maybe this needs clarification then as when before our flyin this year the BMFA were approached on this point exactly. The reply from them was different in that the club and its officers are covered and will be defended by BMFA's insurers etc should any claim be made against them whether or not it involved an RCHA pilot or not.

[barney]

The only downside for me is that I can no longer advertise things for sale on the BMFA forum which I used quite a lot

Any SAA member can register with the BMFA by using there SAA membership No. It just takes a little longer for the confirmation to come through.

[barney]

500 people

Thats actually a Lot of members. The SAA total is around 2000 per annum.

[C8RLS]

As the Insurance is not available I have just joined RCHA for the year to show my support lets hope next year the numbers can be acheived!

[Mark_T]

As the saying goes 'When life gives you lemons, make lemonade...'

Let's try to make the RCHA the best 'special interest' group it can be and leave the insurance and club politics issues out of things for now.

We can be pro-RC helis without having to be anti-BMFA.

It was always a bold step to jump right in with insurance and force a confrontation with BMFA in the first year of its existence so now let's see if taking a slightly less stressful approach can build numbers, deliver enhancements to the hobby and generally grow a representative body for our sport.

Let's see what we can do working together rather than spend our time arguing about the way we ended up here.

Just have to decide if you want to stay sour about the whole thing, or enjoy the lemonade

[Captain Crash]

Dave W quoted "The RCHA in trying to persuade us all to leave the BMFA and join the RCHA was always a non starter."

I don't believe this was ever the case, Stuart merely offered an alternative!!

I'm not very computer literate but can we setup a poll with the question

"If RCHA insurance was accepted as an equal and accepted at all events and competitions regardless of who sanctions it, would you choose BMFA or RCHA???

I earlier used the word Monopoly which some have taken offence to, i can see why the BMFA would feel threatened by giving a choice.

If you buy car insurance, why does it cover you to drive anywhere in the world?????

You don't go to Germany and they say well they're our German roads so unless you buy our insurance you are Not Insured to drive on them do they?