BMFA B Test

[trvo]

Since the other thread started by TimmyB is closed (and I can't be bothered to read it), just to lay down what the B Test is about and not about (in my words).

- To show that the pilot has a set level of control over his heli (or greater)
- To show the pilot understands the rules about safety at the field and a display
- To show the pilot can fly safely within those rules
- To show that the pilot can perform the necessary checks to be sure his heli and radio etc are in a safe condition.

The test is not about display flying, it's just an achievement which states you can fly a B test schedule, can abide by rules and have knowledge of display flight rules. The test also shows the pilot has the right attitude towards flight safety, and that he / she can obey an instruction and do as he / she is told immediately and without question should the need arise.

What has happened is a big game of chinese whispers where the B test has become known as the "Licence for display flight" because it was used as such by event organisers.

In reality, no test will ever show a pilot will be 100% safe when flying at a display, mistakes happen (especially at competitions).

I think the best way to proceed rather than moaning about the B test is to work with the AHA / BMFA to ensure that a pilot does have control in all orientations that his / her chosen discipline requires by introducing a test to demonstrate that the pilot can recover from any orientation they will find themselves in - it should also demonstrate the fundamentals that are currently displayed in the B Test. Then all you need to do is get the B test pilots to take it and the event organisers to stop accepting B's (upsetting a lot of people in the meantime) - but then where do you draw the line?

Just thought I'd attempt to clear this up (hopefully)!

Trev

[Steve]

In a nutshell Trev.

[moonmanflyer]

Right on Trev

[Guest]

the event organisers to stop accepting B's

I don’t know if this was covered in the other post but the latest update from the BMFA says that a B no longer entitles you to fly at a display. It comes down to the event organiser to reassess you at each site to make sure you are safe.

Gareth

[trvo]

I don’t know if this was covered in the other post but the latest update from the BMFA says that a B no longer entitles you to fly at a display. It comes down to the event organiser to reassess you at each site to make sure you are safe.

Gareth

Correct, but this isn't something new, it was always the case but the rules have been re-worded to make sure that it's understood better - this is due to it being mis-interpreted in the past.

Trev

[davie]

there seems to be a lot off people that want to criticise that the b sert is not enough for comp , show flying , as described below it is a competence test that most event organisers adopt as a minimum to fly , they have got to start somewhere as do the pilots if it a case off to do comps you will have to do a number off set manouvers then you will find that comps will turn into elite status where most will not bother as the test to enter will be harder than flying the event . lets face it everone can have a bad day and look terible in the air , this is a hobby and as long as its kept safe whats the problem letting people fly if the event is run properly the the chances of accidents are low , the most important thing in flying to me is not how it looks but how well a person can recover from any situation if its done in a safe manner ie still on the flight line that person has the right to fly an event after all we all got to start somewhere, you pass your driving test you are alowed to drive anywhere dont mean you are a good driver ,, far to many people want to judge what they think is good flying or whatever what i say is leave it to the people that set the standards and dont put the hobby out off the reach off the people that are trying to enjoy their hobby just my thoughts

[antsis]

It's correct that a B cert is not necessarily needed for display flying. However, most events would rather a pilot has one because if there was an incident, it looks better on the insurance claim.

[Mike W]

I think in essence the B test is a good idea as it shows the pilot has the ability to fly all orientations the right way up ..As for comps we all have to start somewhere dont we ? .... Theres loads of very good pilots out there that dont think 3d is the be all and end all of the hobby tbh I love watching it but like flying the way I do , if in the future 3d is what i wanna do then I might try it ...It's like everyone has said before when you pass your car test it dont make you a good driver. All of us are always learning in this hobby and thats the fun part of it at the end of the day fun ... If you dont want to take the test then dont , but I will take the B in the future as its something to aspire to in this hobby

[Brian Gifford]

I'm still at the novice stage, a long way even from my "A", which I do aspire to. But I've read an awful lot on here, and other forums, of advice for newbies. This advice is always learn to control your heli in all orientations before you try any fancy stunts. I think this translates directly to the "B" - If a pilot can't display the control needed to pass the "B", why on earth would anyone trust him/her to fly near the public in a display/comp?. It's not a perfect world, but certs like the "A" and "B" are a benchmark that pilots can be measured against. Passing either the A or B I regard as a challenge, rather than a PITA, and hopefully I might get there in a few years.

[Andy from Sandy]

Every poster in the main keeps going on about it shows an ability to fly. This is really only half the story.

I am a little suspicious of people who on spec take their B test at a fly-in and I am even more suspicious of people who state, "The examiner guided them through the safety questions." To my mind this waters down the aspect of the test that shows you really understand the safety implications of flying model helicopters. Once you have gained your "B" you should be fully competent to not only fly safely but to know how to set up your own event and control a flight line.

I think in essence the B test is a good idea as it shows the pilot has the ability to fly all orientations the right way up.

Which only covers the first of Trevors main points and not the other 3!

[Mike W]

Which only covers the first of Trevors main points and not the other 3!

I was talking about the practical side .. The other aspects of the B every pilot should already know and practice each time they get to the field and then before they start there heli up .. Me I do pre flights before I leave the house , preflight and range check at the field and observe a safe manner in which Tx and rx is turned on and the way I start my model .. I also at the end of each day post flight check my models .. The flying side of it is the easiest part of the test, its the rest that you have to do that needs drilling into peoples heads Safety first and foremost

[pchristy]

Trev,

That may well be the case, but it certainly didn't start out like that! The problem is that changes have been made without them being adequately publicised, and this has been one of the big issues I have had with the BMFA.

A little history lesson:

Back in the late 70's there were a couple of very high profile serious accidents. These attracted the attention of the National Press, who wanted to know what the authorities were going to do about these "dangerous missiles" that were threatening every household in the land. The Government looked round for someone to dump the responsibility on, and spotted the CAA.

The CAA were not really interested in models, having bigger fish to fry, but having been told to do something about it, they decided that if their slumber was going to be disturbed, *someone* was going to pay dearly for it - and guess who that was going to be?

With the threat of the CAA imposing (expensive) licenses to fly models, the BMFA decided to get of its backside and pre-empt them. Hence the achievement scheme.

So you are right - it wasn't intended as a display license, bit it WAS intended to replace the CAA proposal for a license to be able to fly ANY model!

In the intervening years, it has slowly been watered down, and my big concern over the present Heli "B" is the total lack of any check for "handedness" - something that has caught out quite a few pilots - me included - down the years. Personally, I do not believe that the present "B" does what it claims - ie demonstrates an adequate minimum level of ability.

With regards to it being perceived as a "display" license, again, responsibility for this can be laid squarely at the door of the BMFA. It was they who insisted that it be used as a requirement for entry to the Nationals, on the grounds that the Nationals is a public event. Everyone else has simply followed their lead!

I've been banging a drum about this for nearly 3 years now, and getting nowhere! It has been quite entertaining watching the BMFA Technical Secretary tying himself in a Gordian Knot trying to explain it all - and failing miserably!

The whole thing is a can of worms, and my own view is that the best thing that could happen to the Achievement Scheme is for it to be scrapped and started again from scratch! This time with properly defined criteria to stick to!

(Gets off soap-box, again!)

--
Pete

[Tosh]

Seems to me that this whole B debate was started by a bloke who couldn`t pass it and then spat his dummy and blamed everyone else. This is not uncommon in the youth of today, l have an eighteen year old who so far has never been to blame for anything that went wrong in her life. The B was working fine till TimmyB failed it so why change things now? He`s not the only one to fail a test but most just take it on the chin and try again later.
lf it aint broke fix it till it is. Comes to mind.

[Disc]

Ah you might want to read the BMFA Club buletin 187

British Model Flying Association - BMFA - Club Bulletins

The 'A' and 'B' are discussed in this one for helicopters

[davie]

the biggest problem i see is if you set the standards to high you are gona make a big dent in the hobby , the certs have got be atainable for all levels not just the young guys that seem to take to it no problems , if the tests are not atainable by the average flyer then this will take up time for both the novice and those who have atained their certs as the novice will need to be supervised in an ideal world that would be fine but it then puts preshure on both parties to be there to supervise and fly , it dosnt work as both get fed up with it . as for flying in shows etc what do you do test every entrant to see if they are at a sutible level before the event , more time and money remember this is an ameture hobbie most do it for the love of flying , if thing go in that direction it will become elitest and a lot of people will fall away from it witch will make it all the harder to sustain clubs , personaly i dont have the silver sert as i stay in scotland only because i have never neaded it i do fly mild 3d chaos tictocs piedishes etc but because i dont have the proper certs i dont fly shows, comps it dont mean i cant fly safely just never got round to doing them , in sumary its has to do with who tests you a good tester will know if you are safe or not simple as that , its a hobby witch in my mind means open to all
edit i do have the bronze cert witch alows me to fly unaided