Fb & fbl?

[cabbie10]

Tried to search but didn't find answers.

Whats the advatage of FBL other than looking nicer?

[trillian]

I'm sure there are threads on this. Put as simply as possible, FBL allows you to have very fast cyclics but still have stability in wind and the ability of the heli to hold a position when there are no control inputs.

With a flybar you are always operating in a balance between giving the flybar the authority to hold a position and still having quick cyclics when you want them. (but it depends on your flying style because if you don't need lightning-fast cyclics a flybar can be tuned to provide very good stability - at present flybars are still used in F3C competition). At the moment flybars are still better for really precise hovering but I would imagine FBL will catch up at some point.

The other advantage is that the flybar does use some power due to drag and the extra weight so in theory you have a bit more power with FBL.

[cabbie10]

Thanks for explanation

[AnthonyMcEwen]

What's better for a beginner though and why...there's pros and coins to each for a beginner such as. Less damage to to less parts but at the same time if you brake the fbl unit that a lot of money to replace compered to a snatard gyro?

[AcidDrink]

What's better for a beginner though and why...there's pros and coins to each for a beginner such as. Less damage to to less parts but at the same time if you brake the fbl unit that a lot of money to replace compered to a snatard gyro?

Flybarless is the only way you want to go, except if someone give you a FB heli for free. Flybar is obsolete and unnecessary burden, it's much easier to setup a FBL unit and it will make heli easier to fly and more predictable.

[AnthonyMcEwen]

So guys is this the general consensus or what so people think. ^^^ :-)

[waveydavey]

What's better for a beginner though and why...there's pros and coins to each for a beginner such as. Less damage to to less parts but at the same time if you brake the fbl unit that a lot of money to replace compered to a snatard gyro?

For a beginner, and I'll buck the trend here and say go with a flybar. It will teach you more about the mechanics and the science of rotary flight than setting up some box of tricks. You can't set up a fbl system without being able to fly, yes you can plug it in and it will work, set it up without really understanding the terminology that it's discussing and it will fly. However, you will never understand what the fbl system is doing, you won't understand the settings, etc etc

Less damage to what a bit of 2mm steel and the odd paddle, for the record both my helis are fbl and I wouldn't go back but thats for other factors. Go with the flybar and learn what you like, learn your feel as it's a personal thing and only you will know what you like and how you want the machine to fly. What suits you may not suit somone else

[waveydavey]

Flybarless is the only way you want to go, except if someone give you a FB heli for free. Flybar is obsolete and unnecessary burden, it's much easier to setup a FBL unit and it will make heli easier to fly and more predictable.

More predictable, how?

[cjcj1949]

Vikki learned recently and was much more impressed with flybarless, especially in wind. A flybarless seems to think it's a bigger heli. I was looking at someone flying a 130 a week ago and it seemed to fly like a 450. He agreed and so it wasn't my imagination. They do cost more though although a cheap flybarless like a Tarot is about the same as a good gyro (Quark). There are lots of views on how good a gyro or flybarless controller needs to be. I'm impressed with a £7 gyro - the Assan 250. You can get better if you pay more, but it's not a bad idea to know what you want first and know that the better thing will give you what you want. I'm impressed with the msrx at the price - £50. I didn't like the nano when I flew it, but it was setup to be very acrobatic. Flybars won't get better, but flybarless will. I doubt if flybars will be around for long.

[AnthonyMcEwen]

Some intresiting, I guess in the end it will all be FBL but yet some mmanufacturers are trying to make there vbars feel like fly bars, surely this says something....

It seems that the efficiency, looks and all the other benefits above mentioned of FBL is wanted but at the same time we still want it to feel like a real fly bar....kind of the benefits of having no fly bar but yet maintains the benefits of having one...

Well that's the impression I'm getting anyways.., I have not flown a collecotve flybared machine but my mcpx is always feeling like it dose what I want it to and stays were I I want it to without too much input from my limited experiance so far...

[AnthonyMcEwen]

So in other words we don't necessarily need nor want FBL we want a fly bar without the conns of having one and FBL is a best of both worlds system ....if this makes any sense.

[waveydavey]

At the end of the day a fbl system is a replacement for a mechanical gyro (flybar) and seeks to replicate this through programming. My point is that unless you can fly you won't know how to setup a fbl system. Yes, you can set it as the manual suggests and you will have a model that flys, the BeastX flys out of the box and most would be satisfied with how it flys. But thats where it would stop, you wouldn't be able to take it further as you can't and don't need to understand the mechanical setup.

[waveydavey]

So in other words we don't necessarily need nor want FBL we want a fly bar without the conns of having one and FBL is a best of both worlds system ....if this makes any sense.

Yep, that makes sense

[trillian]

For a beginner, and I'll buck the trend here and say go with a flybar. It will teach you more about the mechanics and the science of rotary flight than setting up some box of tricks. You can't set up a fbl system without being able to fly, yes you can plug it in and it will work, set it up without really understanding the terminology that it's discussing and it will fly. However, you will never understand what the fbl system is doing, you won't understand the settings, etc etc

Less damage to what a bit of 2mm steel and the odd paddle, for the record both my helis are fbl and I wouldn't go back but thats for other factors. Go with the flybar and learn what you like, learn your feel as it's a personal thing and only you will know what you like and how you want the machine to fly. What suits you may not suit somone else

I wholeheartedly agree. To me it makes a lot of sense for the following reasons;
1. As long as the linkage is close enough to being right, the paddles are close enough to being in line with the flybar carrier and each other, basically if the mechanical side isn't way out the heli will fly and it won't do anything crazy. With the FBL system certain things have to be pretty darn correct or the heli could be unflyable, very difficult or seem to be fine but then could suddenly do something very unexpected.

2. By starting with a flybar you'll have a baseline for reference of what a heli is supposed to feel like on the controls (in a general sense). Otherwise unless someone else flies it you may not realise if something is wrong on a FBL setup that can give the heli a misleading impression of how it should really fly.

3. A flybarred heli is likely to be much more tolerant of wobbly landings and takeoffs that can sometimes cause FBL units to tip the heli over on the ground.

4. You might just like the way it flies with a flybar :-)

[MarkG_R1]

Fb & fbl?

When I converted my 450 from flybar to barless it was the extra stability that made my mind up

I could actually put more time into thinking about manoeuvres than spending time correcting the Heli from falling over

11 months into the hobby and I'm well clear of flybars now other than my long term loan raptor 30 which will soon see even less use with the completion of my 550 dfc build