kds 450 wobble and fall over :(

[Ryoken]

i got a kds 450 qs
well i thought id have a go at flying , (hahaha)
took heli onto field , throttled up to about 40 to 50%,. all it did was topple over not stable at all. just powered up and tipped., reminded me of being on a tight rope and falling of from either side.
powered it up , about 1/2 heli wobbled and i had to kill the throttle , or it would have cracked the blades into the grass.

after 5 mins of this patetic attempt at heli flying i walked home hacked off. then noticed that while my heli was doing the tight rope impression , i had hit the tail boom. . no real damage
the heli has just come back from being setup after i corrupted the tranny settings.
does any one have any ideas on why it is doing this?

cos at the mo , ive spent 200 quid on a nice ornament for the pc desk

[franky975]

If it just been set-up probably been flown so should been ok. I would look for something around the head, mechanical parts been damaged/broken in transit or a poped off linkage. If you had a boom strike i would recommend to inspect the blades for damage as well!

[Stevec]

It sounds to me like you need a bit of sim time or better to find someone who can test fly it for you.

it may just need trimming out, or it may need the servos centering up. as helicopters reach take off lift they do tend to squirrel about due to the side thrust from the tail.
My 450 and 250 flybarless helicopters need a fair amount of right cyclic as they lift off due to rolling left.
once up in the air it is fine.
you probably wont hurt anything by uping the throttle curves a bit as well, hovering should be about 70% throttle (this is very much down to personal preference though)

hope this helps
Steve

[Ryoken]

cheers for the reply lads , yeah its quite common for me to hit the boom , it seems ,i inspect the blades everytime , and fit new
im making a hk450 mt (another thread) to fully understand how the heli is put together and "works"
as for sim training , ive been on plenty, and the behavour of the RC and the sim are totally different

Steve

[Stevec]

kds 450 wobble and fall over

cheers for the reply lads , yeah its quite common for me to hit the boom , it seems ,i inspect the blades everytime , and fit new
im making a hk450 mt (another thread) to fully understand how the heli is put together and "works"
as for sim training , ive been on plenty, and the behavour of the RC and the sim are totally different

Steve

Agreed but if the tipping is due to the thrust from the side you need to be able to hover out of ground effect. And the sim will train your thumbs to do the right thing without you thinking about it.
And believe me trying to hover an out of trim heli will need you to be on it.

Have you checked the set up mechanically?
Are the blades at zero pitch at centre stick? (Disconnect the motor wires before trying this)
Is the swash level? Does it stay level as you go up and down the pitch range(collective)?
Is the main shaft bent?
If you did any damage to a blade the odds are the feathering shaft is bent. (The rod between the blade grips.)

Once you have made sure the mechanics are ok and the swash is behaving itself then you can try lifting into the hover.

Get some training undercarriage on there, it will increase the amount out of shape it needs to be in before the blades hit the ground.

There are many methods of learning to fly, I did it on my own and the helicopter was essentially a land vehicle for the first few weeks. Skidding around on the training under carriage getting a feel for the controls.
Then short hops while moving slowly forwards and me walking about behind it. Then stop walking about and hover it.

There are much better ways these days and the simulator is my chosen training aid, it may feel different, but if you can fly a decent helicopter in pheonix then doing it for real comes easy. The only real difference is there is no financial or physical danger in the sim and it is amazing how much that makes you pucker up!

Good luck.
/Steve

[Ryoken]

cheers steve , ill have a look , i ws planning to take the hk450 out for a spin to see if it was just the kds that was damaged, but after building the hk up , noticed the rotor blade mounts were uneven , took it apart , found out nothing was wrong , and on re assembly lost one of the thrust bearings, , i think the dog eat it and im buggered if im going to look thru his poo for it
ordered another one

you know , i know this is only a hobby, and i know its not classed as a Toy , but ive got a hayabusa parked outside and that hasnt given me THIS much greif

[David Drew]

It sounds to me like you need a bit of sim time or better to find someone who can test fly it for you.


Steve

+1 for that!

A pal of mine had exactly the same problem. They are not easy to set up. They are not the best quality and we ended up replacing many failed parts or crash damaged parts with better alternatives.

He was getting quite hacked-off and demotivated as a noob and it took a bit of persuading to get him to carry on. I am pleased to say that after he invested in some new parts at the 3D Champs we completely re-built and re-programmed it and it flew really well from first hover.

Get help - you won't regret it

[helijohn]

the heli has just come back from being setup after i corrupted the tranny settings.
does any one have any ideas on why it is doing this?

Have youconsidered using some trainers - especially if the bird has been set up by someone else. This reminds me of some of my funny moments before I learned to hover. As has been said, now I could correct for any wrong mechanical setup but I still use the trainers on an unknown quantity.

[Ryoken]

i use training balls. granted not 100% of the time , i know when there on you can really see the heli lean over to the side when its being throttled up , and i know if they wernt on the heli it would have been on its side, there is something seriously not right with this heli , but at he mo , and i know i shouldnt be , but ive got right hacked off with it , and am spending more time on the one im building up from scratch , i have only taken the heli (kds) to one guy to get repaired, but he was recommended.
in a way im learning how to fix and setup the kds (and any other 450 heli) by building up this one from scratch. and so far ive learned alot , i remember it costing me 90 quid for him to supply and fit (3 servos) and set up the heli after the first crash (must make sure the main shafts or feathering aint bent) (curriosity) , i now know how to do this , so i dont have to do that again , also with the tranny settings ,ive had to do that aswell on the new hk450mt, so again , its all learning , its just so far up to press ive had about 10 seconds in the air , and not actually flown , just bloody repaired and built and played on the phoenix....

still apart from the crashing , im enjoying it so far ,