Another newbie :)

[LipolyGone]

I've got a Dragonus and it doesn't seem at all twitchy to me,but I don't have anything to compare it to.The head is mechanically programmable from beginner to 3D.It's also available for £25.00 less than a Mini Titan.

It's certainly responsive,but will sit in a hover more or less hands off.

Allan

I'm talking about the new Dragonus, the pro ll mate.
It's £250 just for the kit.
martin

[MeGrimm]

Hi MeGrimm

Welcome to the hobby.

I was in your shoes about 3 or 4 months ago. I was also scared about committing £££'s to the hobby, so I bought myself a Solaris 3D from Sussex Model Centre. For those of you that have not heard of the model, its a re-branded mini-pred.

For £180 I got EVERYTHING a newbie would need - ready to fly heli, transmitter, gyro, training gear, FMS simulator, battery and charger. Seems like a bargain, right? Well, it was, until I flew it. Then I realised that the package was designed for someone who had nothing, and being a plank flyer for many years, I had a little more than that. I now know I would have been better off spending £300 to ensure that some key things were a little better. I bought a GY401 gyro and a better tail rotor servo and that transformed the heli.

I've learnt to hover on it and I've now moved on to a .50 sized nitro machine. I still fly the electric more than the nitro, thanks to the local park.

My advice? Spend as much as you can afford. The mini-pred served my purposes, but it is a twitchy little beast and, frankly, I think I learned to hover on the sim, not on the heli.

If I were doing it all again, I'd get myself a mini titan / Trex 450S or something non-blinged, get two or three battery packs and a el-cheapo lipo charger for no more than £20. You *should* be able to get away for all this for under £300 and its a better way to start. Thats assuming you already have radio gear. If not, add £200 on to that for a DX7 sans servo's, or which-ever brand you'd prefer.

eBay? I'd stay away until you know more about the hobby. New is better, as it comes without a prior history and with a friendly smile from your local model shop. Don't discount the value of buying local. The invaluable support and advice for when things go wrong is worth far more than the money one can save by going the internaltion mail-order route.

Good luck and I hope that helps.

Regards
Andrew

EDIT: Oh my g****. I forgot to strongly recommend you get a simulator. Its really the best thing even before sliced bread. I've used FMS (cheap and nasty, does the trick), RealFlight G3 (like the yanks, its big and fat and over-rated & overpriced) and now Phoenix Sim (brilliant, lean mean **** machine, great value for money).

Thanks Philimon, seems like very balanced advice. I don't know what you mean by having nothing or something etc. Do you mean radio gear? Coz I have nothing! I have a bit of 40Mhz stuff for boats but obviously I can't use that!

I'm also suprised that gyros work better with one heli than another. I kind of assumed they're a bit like servos, plug in and play anywhere

As you can see I'm very new to most of the details. I was kind of hoping I could get a heli as a kit or preferably RTF (hate that, but I'm not very confident with getting everything airworthy first time if I build it myself from parts) to reduce the variables as much as possible. I accepted that I may have to replace the odd servo / bearing / hub even but not too much more just yet. Back to reality eh?

[richieclarkie]

You've obviously got a reasonable idea of what you are getting yourself into so my advice follows they general concensus which is:

TREX 450 V2
(Use the supplied motor and ESC, they are fine)
Battery - Get a decent'ish battery to add to the manyfacturer supplied one. The Revvo packs are supposed to be very good, but also Thunder power or Flight power - Don't skimp on these.
Gyro - The ONLY way to go is a 401 and a good servo, the most popular being 9650
Servos - 3 x Hitec 65MG for the cyclic(metal ones, not carbonite)
DX7 - Superb tranny that will be worry free - Do not get the set with servos included, (DS821) they are not suitable and not safe
Charger - A decent quality Lipo charger
Flight Sim - An absolute must is the Phoenix Flight Sim (it taught me to hover with all controls on my first buddied flight) You can use the DX7 with it.

Totalling this up you will need to pay about £830 less any discount from suppliers in this country. You ought to be able to save 20% if you bought from abroad Taiwan, but this is not for everyone.

I know that all seems like alot of money, but it's a "buy it once" approach that makes alot of sense if you can stretch to it. There are lots of ways to save in this hobby, but in my experience they end up costing you more in the long run.

Good Luck

[Philimon]

RichieClarkie, thats certianly a top-spec setup you've got there. Spending that sort of money will definitately give one the 'best-possible' experience.

However, I think its quiet possible to get a good-enough setup for a little less

If one was to try to save a little money and was prepared to make some compromises, what do you think of the following suggestion?
1. Mini-titan deal from RealRaptors for £395
2. From Sussex Model Centre, a Power Supply and Charger for £40
3. Either a DX7 without servos for £200, or a JR 2610 TX & R770S RX from Inwood for £100
4. A TX Charger (both sets above will need one) for around £15

So, the total price for the 2.4Ghz is £ £650, or £550 for a 35Mhz variant.

For that little bit extra, the DX7 certianly is an appealing choice. I would add another Lipo to the above for an extra £35 or so. Of course, Phoenix is another £80 from all good local hobby stores.

Thoughts & comments?

[Philimon]

Thanks Philimon, seems like very balanced advice. I don't know what you mean by having nothing or something etc. Do you mean radio gear? Coz I have nothing! I have a bit of 40Mhz stuff for boats but obviously I can't use that!

Yip, the spec I've listed above assumed you've not go gear, but does assume that you've got a few allen keys and some locktite etc required for assembly.

I'm also suprised that gyros work better with one heli than another. I kind of assumed they're a bit like servos, plug in and play anywhere

As far as I am aware, a gyro will work on any heli. What is true, however, is that smaller heli's have much more limited space, so a large cumbersome gyro like the GY611 from futaba just won't fit! Universal opinion here is that the Gy401 is the best value-for-money option, but at £100, its not cheap.

As you can see I'm very new to most of the details. I was kind of hoping I could get a heli as a kit or preferably RTF (hate that, but I'm not very confident with getting everything airworthy first time if I build it myself from parts) to reduce the variables as much as possible. I accepted that I may have to replace the odd servo / bearing / hub even but not too much more just yet. Back to reality eh?

The mini-pred I bought was an arft. On the surface, thats a good thing. Get it into the air nice and quickly and its factory-flown, so it should be okay, right? Well, unfortunately, my heli was not assembled perfectly and I had to correct a few issues when I got it, once of which would have resulted in a write-off crash. Also, because I'd not assembled it myself, I felt very insecure when I needed to strip it for the first time to replace a part.

My Raptor 50 was a bag of bits when I bought it. Now that its assembled, I'm completely relaxed at the prospect of taking things apart and putting them back together again. Also, I know its built properly.

Just my 2P worth.

Good luck on your first purchase. Do keep us informed as to what your final choice is.

Regards
Andrew

[richieclarkie]

Hi Phil

The deal real raptors are doing is good isn't it. However not many people I have spoken to have recommended the mini-titan. Also I don't know how good or bad the CSM gyro is, many of the experienced flyers at my club would probably advise to stay away from the CSM and get a 401. I would strongly suggest the metal geared HITEC HS65 MGs, not the HBs.

It does come with Radix blades which is cool, but for a begginer, totally unecessary and therefore I would advise some wooden ones to start with.

Also if you come to sell the V2 you are going to get an excellent residual value on it and sell easily. Not that you'd want to sell it I'm sure.

By the way, on the charger front, get a pro-peak prodigy II. Will charge your TX and 3 cell lipos. About £50

We are actually only talking about £65 difference between the deals which to me seems nothing when what's important is to buy the best you can afford and get the best learning experience.

Also I rekon there's 10% off my price is you buy all that from one dealer in this country. Maybe more if you pushed

Try http://www.mrmodels.co.uk

My opinions, but everyone's are valid

[Philimon]

Hi RitchieClarkie

Thank you - your input proved my point - get the best you can afford. Which, I think, was actually yours too.

I was trying to find an alternative to a newbie that didn't involve spend £850 GBP, though. Thats quiet a daunting amount, don't you think?

Regards
Andrew

[MeGrimm]

Ahem, daunting indeed! And a few times more than I was expecting I know you get what you pay for and I'd give the same advice in other hobbies that I have a bit more experience in. I also realise that you can't take any chances with a model like this and that a seemingly small matter on the ground translates into a HUGE matter in flight etc...

But earning what I do that's a vast amount of money! Maybe this is gonna take longer than I expected...

The Trex seems a very popular choice and obviously is an 'investment' heli which is what I wanted. It's also not much bigger than I'd envisaged and parts seem to be available easily enough. Time to start saving. Gulp!

I have to say I'm suprised not to see mention of the Hornet and the likes here, or even the Honeybee etc. Why is that? I'm just curious...

PS: My PC aint up to much and panics even when I open more than 2 programmes at a time, and there's no way it would run a SIM, so I guess I'll have to do it the oldfashioned (and expensive, ouch!) way. Or add the cost of a new PC into the picture (ouch!) I'm not stingy, just poor!

[Philimon]

There is an alternative...

Buy yourself a mini-pred or similar. Its got everything a newbie needs. The flight sim, FMS, flies fine on a PC thats around 3-4 years old. No, its not the best set-up around, and I'll get lambasted by people who know better, but the truth is that I'm flying mine now, and it works.

Yes, you get what you pay for. But its a way of getting into the air without spending £800.

If you're wary of that, then consider something like the JP Bell medivac. Its more a toy than a heli and is only suited for indoors, but many people on this forum own similar heli's and they do serve a purpose. And, at around £120 all up, its a little cheaper.

Its your money. Only you know truely how much you can afford. Good luck.

[MeGrimm]

Whatever I choose is going to upset / dissapoint somebody on here and I'd love to go the Trex way but I'd also like to get flying within the year!

That mini pred does look tempting, even if it's not perfect. If it flies even half as well as claimed it should keep me going for ages. Philimon, what problems did you have with it and which parts did you have to replace? If I go for that heli I might as well add all those things into the equation while I'm at it...

[ChrisB]

Whatever I choose is going to upset / dissapoint somebody on here and I'd love to go the Trex way but I'd also like to get flying within the year!

That mini pred does look tempting, even if it's not perfect. If it flies even half as well as claimed it should keep me going for ages. Philimon, what problems did you have with it and which parts did you have to replace? If I go for that heli I might as well add all those things into the equation while I'm at it...

I have read thru this post and many other posts like it,at the end of the day its your money and nobody on here will be upset with whatever you decide to go for,if the funds for the best are not available and thanks to living in Blairs Britain many feel the pinch,just consider everybodys options,seek local advice and go for it

Cheaper sims as mentioned previously are just as effective as the top of the range ones

Until money grows on trees we all have to go for whats viable and affordable or not bother at all

Just follow good advice and dont buy a Turkey

[Philimon]

Whatever I choose is going to upset / dissapoint somebody on here and I'd love to go the Trex way but I'd also like to get flying within the year!

That mini pred does look tempting, even if it's not perfect. If it flies even half as well as claimed it should keep me going for ages. Philimon, what problems did you have with it and which parts did you have to replace? If I go for that heli I might as well add all those things into the equation while I'm at it...

If someone forced me to put together a shopping list for a newbie for a mini-pred toe-dipping exercise, this is what I'd do:

Immediate purchase:
1 x mini-pred @ £190
1 x Hitec HS-55 servo for tail @ £10
1 x 1700mah 3S lipo @ £30
TOTAL: £230

I'd then recommend the following upgrades once the craft is in the air:
1 x GY401 gyro @ £100 (or £70 off ebay if you're willing to buy non-local)
1 x JR 2610 radio only at £60 (from www.inwoodmodels.co.uk)
1 x JR 77S synthesised PCM reciever for £40, also from inwood
Total: £210

I'd also strongly recommend a charger upgrade, as per previous post
1 x 10A power supply @ £25
1 x el-cheapo 4S lipo charger @ £20max or Pro-peak prodigy II @ £50
Total: £75

If funds extend, buy as much as one can afford - I've listed the parts in order of priority. When done, it will be exactly what I have now, except the Transmitter.

Once the heli is received, get the flight sim working and practise on that. While thats happening, strip the heli down to its component peices and rebuild, using loctite on all metal-to-metal components. I would strongly suggest that one not even consider starting the heli up at all until one can hover properly on the sim. That means keeping the heli in one place for at least a minute, and being able to land properly, too, without any sideways motion when touching down.

They say that 80% of people who leave this hobby do so after their first crash, because it happens so easily and can be expensive.

For around £500, you've got a heli that will fly. Eventually, though, you'll want to upgrade. At least this way you'll have dipped your toes and will have spent incrementally. Not a perfect route, but the cash investment will be spread over several months.

Others will recommend that you spend a little more and get a decent kit. I certianly would encourage you to explore getting a Trex instead. It will require you to spend more up front, but you'll wind up with a better product in the end.

Take your choices, pay your money. What worked for me won't necessarily work for you.

End of essay.

[richieclarkie]

You certainly won't be upsetting me or I'm sure anyone else whatever you decide. It's your money not ours I'm just expressing my personal opinions.

In my case I wasted £500 on the wrong kit before buying the right thing for me. I am therefore always keen to suggest going for the best you can afford.

Why not buy a sim and tranny and learn to fly virtually first? Be patient and save for the heli you want be it a mini pred or a trex and kit is out first time with the right stuff when you can afford it.

All ideas

[Boggy]

Why not buy a sim and tranny and learn to fly virtually first? Be patient and save for the heli you want be it a mini pred or a trex and kit is out first time with the right stuff when you can afford it.

All ideas

wise words indeed!

philimon total £515 to end up with a blinged mini pred? NOoooooooo

[Philimon]

wise words indeed!
philimon total £515 to end up with a blinged mini pred? NOoooooooo

I hear you loud and clear. Is there an alternative for the same price?

Remember, only £0.01 is for the heli itsself. The rest is for all the stuff that comes with it!!!