Electrical Glitches

[David Drew]

Hi all... just found your site from Google

Quite new to this. Have a Raptor 30 that I'm fine with, although still learning to do figures of eight etc.

Also have a Swift 16 which I am setting up. I'm fairly OK with the basic set ups but am concerned about electrical glitching. Happens most flights, some small some not so small, but I am nrevous about flying it too far off the ground until I have solved the glitching.

Have relocated the ESC as far as I can from the receiver, routed the servo leads opposite side to the aerial & even wrapped the receiver in baco foil as one shop advised me to try. Maybe a small reduction in glitching, maybe imagination.

getting no interference from the Raptor, so this appears to be an electric heli issue.

Have heard PCM will stop this, but also that if I do get a glitch it will lock out & crash anyway.

A friend has a Trex 450 with the same problems...but more frequent.

Someone suggested running metal tail drives to stop static build up. Is static the cause of glitching?

There seems to be a wealth of skill in rcheliaddict...I could do with some heading my way!!

Any advice?


Thanks,

David

[Ade_Law]

welcome, hang around you will enjoy it!

2 things cause glitchs on models

the first is the electrics themselves. bad component placement or faulty components are the main cause.

the other is metal to metal interfence from the model. loose bolts and faulty bearings are a major cause. I have heard of static build up on tail belts causing problems too.

The other problem is that some models are just "noisey" so normal PPM rxs will glitch no matter what. this is where signal processing rxs like the schulze and PCM recievers come in handy.

Ade

[flatspins]

I had a few glitches on my T-Rex.
I got a ferrite ring from Inwood models, you just wind the wire that comes from the ESC to the reciever throught it as many times as possible and then plug it back in.
It stopped mine glitching immediatly.

Not sure how it works, must just absord the interference, eliminating it.

Think it only cost a pound or two as well.

[David Drew]

That's interesting.

My Swift has a 'choke' on the ESC to receiver lead, which I think does the same job as a ferrite ring. My pal has the clamp-on type chokes all over his Trex ( where the wire passes through once) but these have had no effect at all.

I cannot find ferrite rings as I understand them (just metal rings that you wind the leads through, most seem what I have always thought of as chokes.) anywhere. All the model shops I visit in the Midlands just look at me blankly.

Ade...is the Swift a notoriously 'noisy' heli?

Thanks

[Ade_Law]

I think ashley davis is the best guy to answer this question being an owner of a swift and somewhat of an electric guru.

Ade

[Leebert]

Ferrite rings are more of a "stone" like material, not metal.
Loop the throttle (cable from the ESC to the rx) lead through at least 3 times - 5 times if you have enough lead length.
Not sure on the nuts and bolts of it but the ring will absorb transients (spikes of energy) that are in the lead and help prevent them getting to the rx and upsetting it.
I think I am in the right ball park. I'm sure someone will say if not.

[Smoothound]

What Rx?
What ESC?
Are you using the ESC to power radio gear or a separate Rx battery?
Swifts have a reputation for being glitchy as hell(like the Trex). A mate has spent loads of cash on his including an Opto isolator to try to fix his problems which it appears it has done. He flew mine the other day and couldn't believe it only twitchched once running PPM Rx, P45 and a short home made aerial

[David Drew]

Futaba twin conversion PPM

Phoenix Castle Creations ESC

Separate Rx battery

Thanks for the info on rings.

I will try to get some & wrap the ESC - Rx lead around as suggested.

Otherwise it may have to be PCM Rx, but scare stories concern me.

Thanks

David

[Smoothound]

On mine I have my ESC on top of Rx battery right out the front with battery cables pointing forwards. Motor cables are on right side looking from above, Rx battery cable and ESC cables to Rx run on opposite side to Rx which is right at rear left corner of Heli, all extra wires are here as well.

[Ade_Law]

the scare stories behind PCM are just that... scare stories, they come from people that dont understand the technology are are just sticking with what they know.

some PCM facts

Lockout is not the final word of a crash the signal has to stay very low quality until it hits the ground.

If that happens to PPM you end up with a model hitting the ground (or people or property) with the engine still running and then trashing around on the ground doing more damage to itself/ground/people/property.

If that happens to PCM the engine cuts to idle so theres no more energy going into the model that it had when it locked out.

so thats a worst case situation. which i think you will agree PCM is preferable!

the next situation is where you have a problem with the model or an external issue causing occasional "issue"

with PPM this shows as a glitch. the servos move to where ever they feel like going this can make the model move in a very bad direct very quickly.

with PCM the rx goes to "hold" mode where it holds all the controls where you last had them. If the signal improves it gives you control back if it doest it goes to full failsafe but carries on checking the signal.

I know what i prefer...

Ade

[David Drew]

You boys are the biz....

better advice than from the 'field' and I'm not freezing my whatsits off either.

So that's it...get a ferrite ring, PCM Rx, and relocate ESC/Rx.I'll slowly upgrade the bearings and other moving parts too to further reduce noise.

I'll give all that a go over the next week or two & get back to you with a result.

Thanks all, really appreciated.



David

[HighlanderJC]

My swift has a seperate RX pack for servos and giro (4.8v). The pack is underneath the front tray above the battery rack. The Rx is on the top tray front right , the ESC is attached to the left front outside of the frame next to the motor, battery wires downwards. The ariel is routed along the bottom right side of the frame. I have no glitching at all.

[David Drew]

Thanks .

I have the Rx right out front on the Rx ledge, wires coming out backwards...maybe I should sent the wires out forward? the battery for RX/servos/giro behind that & the ESC on top of the battery platform, so immediately above the LiPo and under the mast, behind the motor and as far back as the motor leads will allow. This means that I have had to fit an extention to the ESC - Rx lead, but it was glitching before so this is not an issue.

I saw some info in another thread about Kontronic (I think that's the spelling) Rx that seems to resist glitching.

With all this electric glitching thing I think the Raptor is looking to get more use than the swift.

Still, I won't give up because I can see the swifty being a "get it up & fly" model once sorted.


Adcice today from a shop has been change the ESC, go for PCM.

I'll get there

Thanks all for your input

David

[David Drew]

Just put the first battery through having installed a PCM Rx.

So far so good. Looked OK with no issues. Only hovered - just in case.

Thanks all for your advice

David

[HighlanderJC]

My swift is easier to learn on than the trex. You can soften eveything up on the swift much easier.