Co-axial, or not co-axial that is the question

[hufggfg]

Hi guys, absolute newbie here just wanting a bit of advice before I go and buy my first RC Heli.

Firstly, I should say that i'm very used to controlling things from a remote, i'm part of the playstation generation and have always had r/c cars (but no planes) and (i'm sure everyone thinks this!) have pretty good hand eye co-ordination.

I am looking for with get myself a Walkera 4#3b (or Buzzfly) or a Walkera 5G6 (or Buzzfly CX). I have chosen those two, as I am limited on space so the micro size is a must. Now my normal way of doing things is to "jump right in" and would go for the 4#3b and plan on taking it slow and learning to hover etc etc.... but reading the posts on here it is clearly recommended that the first machine should be a co-axial....

Would it be the stupidest thing every to have the 4#3b as a first heli? or would it just take a bit of extra time and patience?

Thanks for your help,

Jamie

p.s. is it just me, or does the search function on this forum not work at all?

[Eddie]

Hi guys, absolute newbie here just wanting a bit of advice before I go and buy my first RC Heli.

Firstly, I should say that i'm very used to controlling things from a remote, i'm part of the playstation generation and have always had r/c cars (but no planes) and (i'm sure everyone thinks this!) have pretty good hand eye co-ordination.

I am looking for with get myself a Walkera 4#3b (or Buzzfly) or a Walkera 5G6 (or Buzzfly CX). I have chosen those two, as I am limited on space so the micro size is a must. Now my normal way of doing things is to "jump right in" and would go for the 4#3b and plan on taking it slow and learning to hover etc etc.... but reading the posts on here it is clearly recommended that the first machine should be a co-axial....

Would it be the stupidest thing every to have the 4#3b as a first heli? or would it just take a bit of extra time and patience?

Thanks for your help,

Jamie

p.s. is it just me, or does the search function on this forum not work at all?

Hi hufggfg, firstly welcome to the site and forum

I think you’ll find the search function works, just depends on what you put in it!

Advice, irrelevant of which starter heli you go for the most sensible will be the Coaxial, being stable and easier to control than a fixed pitch.

If you want a BuzzFlyer call John at BuzzFlyer and he will give you the best advice...I hold him in high regard.

Search a little harder and you will find tons of information……………..

[cambs flyer]

The opinion is a little divided here on Cox'-single rota heli's

I can tell you now mate all the other fun you've had in the past won't count a bean when it comes to flying RC Helicopters, this hobby is the most difficult to learn but the most fun ten fold compared to the rest.

The 4#3b will be far more then you can handle right now, as a member here through no fault of his own discovered a few weeks ago, and in all honesty it will possibly put you off this hobby within a week with breakages and frustration not being in control, and all the other adjustments needed as you learn along the way.

Go for the 5G6, it'll be ideal, it's small but built well, much more crash friendly then the larger Twin Coaxial like the Lama's and excellent Blade CX2.

And if space is a premium the 5G6 will suit you ideally.

Then after you've mastered that little heli, and the urge to go further is within you and I'm sure it will be then we can talk about the Sims and machines to take your hobby to the nest level.

Welcome to the forum and have fun, don't worry about many of the technical problems that comes with flying, everyone here will help you as and when, but the main goal with this hobbie is don't run before you can walk, and with the 4#3b regardless of it's tiny size would be a major mistake now, but might be on the list after you've got some experience under your belt.

The best place to purchase one is here

http://www.chinesejade.com/walkera5g6_Heli.htm

Just add 3-4 extra batts, a couple of motors, main/inner Shafts as spares.

Best of luck mate.

[163phil]

Just got a 4#3b myself, and although it is very controllable with some practise I do think it wold be very difficult to learn on, as when it slides off the bubble it really does go, and you will be violently overcorrecting before the inevitable crash!

A co-ax is very much more stable for the beginner and is ideal for learning orientations etc. These micro helis really do take the punishment well as there is so little inertia in them. Just remember to shut off the throttle before the crash and there should be very little damage

Oh...and welcome to the forum

[hufggfg]

Thanks very much for all the kind words guys.

Looks like i'll go and get myself the co-axial for the moment and once i've had a bit of a play with that decide which way i want to go next!

[cambs flyer]

Take note my friend that a TC heli won't offer much in practice to fly a CCP machine, apart from Cyclic control, the two top rotas keep you off the deck via the throttle, keep the power up and she stays up, failing the pilot doesn't hit or crash into something.

What it will do is give you real flight experience, as I can assure you your first few weeks unless you've a gym to fly in is going to offer many sweaty moments, and also prepare yourself that you will crash, that's OK, these machines are modular, you bust a part your order a replacement, then she's back to new.

Let me give you a few pointers before you start, always have the Heli with the tail facing you, this is called tail in, and is the most comfy way to throttle up a Heli, as all the controls respond to your commands, you turn left she goes left, however if she faces you all of the Cyclic controls on the right stick will be back to front, so stay tail in until you feel more at ease.

Also don't go straight up, do small hover leaps, and gradually get used to her in seconds of flight, then tens of seconds which will progress to minutes, but take it slowly, there's no rule of thumb to how long it takes, trust your instincts and in the very worst case where your out of control drop the Throttle immediately, take the power away from the shafts so she lands with no power, 9/10 depending where she strikes all you may do is bust a blade or get away Scott free, you try and correct a situation you have no control over and your be looking at multiple broken blade strikes and bent inner and outer shafts, it will happen, and when you start repairing and dismantling your bird then your really start to feel at ease with her, understanding a Contra Heli is very simple, it looks worse on the blown diagram, so what I done when I first took my BCX2 apart was as I took something off I made a line of the parts, then when it came to putting her back together I started at that first end and worked my way back, you'll only need to do it the once as after that it'll be a piece of cake.

Plus while in flight the down wash from the rotas will produce unsteady air currents on there own, so when you fly through air space that you've only just been through she will get buffered about somewhat, plus as she's such a small bird she will get buffered about quite a bit, also beware of furniture, flying over sofa's, chairs, TV's will cause insteady wind vortices's, these will make your machine act very strangely, in so much she'll veer off in a direction you wasn't prepared for, you'll quickly gain a feel of her when this happens and counter react the problem before it begins

This will be the best fun you'll ever have so far as big boys toys go, plus the most expensive, but building up a stock pile of spares is something you'll always need to do, luckily the 5g6 has fordable blades which the BCX2 I have doesn't, this will save to far less broken blades and shafts and if you do the above you'll do fine, remember if something busts on the body and you can super glue it do so, as while your learning the basics you will break it again, however anything which compromises the flight replace and don't mend, like blades, or try and straighten out shafts, there a one way trip I'm afraid, yes blades can be fixed if the break is fairly even, but very rarely fly great once there been broken.

I hope this helps bud, however the most important thing is have fun above all, and don't worry about the odd broken boom part, all can be replaced when your more experienced.

[hufggfg]

All that makes sense... apart from..

TC?
CCP?

anyone know of an RC Heli glossary?

[cambs flyer]

Sorry mate, TC, "Twin Coaxial" & CCP "Cyclic collective Pitch" The CCP machine's haven't the safety net of a fixed pitched Heli, where the collective also manages the pitch making it far more maneuverable plus more difficult for the beginner.

CCPM is Cyclic, collective, Pitch mixing, which uses complex pilot programing for all the main rota servos, controlled from the TX, enabling them to perform dazzling Ariel displays, this is the realm for the more advanced flyer's.

[jboweruk]

If I may offer a bit of advice, and it's hard won too:

go for a coax first, but if you can go for one that you can bind a computer radio like the DX6i to, I don't know how the little Buzzfly/Walkera CX's handle, but most are far too gentle, but the fixed pitch single rotor helis are far too nimble, it's a quandry. That's why I say try to dig a little deeper and find one you can hook a Spektrum tx up to, that way as you get better in the hover and it becomes too easy, you can drop the exponential on the sticks to make it more nimble again, that way training your thumbs to be very gentle on the sticks.

I think it's flying the coax's where I have 'heavy thumb'. Something I'm guessing you will have to contend with anyway. FP helis are nimble and need very gentle thumbs. So the best advice I can offer is to make sure you budget for a good simulator (Phoenix seems to have the best heli physics of all), then practice like crazy before you actually fly. Do go for a coax as I say, because you will quickly lose interest otherwise due to the breakages and crashes.

[cambs flyer]

There is an old style Dimms to Phono cable converter supplied with the Walkera stuff, I'm not sure it it's compatible with Phoenix I'll have to experiment a bit later.

John me ole mate I think he's going for the micro Coaxial simply due to lack of flying space, as you and I know the BCX2 size T.C's do demand some breathing space, and I think if the 5G6 is around the size or just a tad larger then the 4#3b, he'll have far more space to practice in.

Unfortunately due to circumstances the expensive route sometimes is the only way some can take, not that it's cheap period.

How you getting on with your Buzzie mate, there fun little blighter's aren't they.

I think with he's present situation buying the 5G6 to start with, then if possible buy Phoenix & the Blade 400 kit may be the cheaper route to the next step, failing some excellent condition S/H equipment is for sale at the time of the big purchase.

What do you think mate.

[jboweruk]

Mine's grounded, did the flybar the first night. Need to sort out a new titanium one.

[unwind-protect]

I think if the 5G6 is around the size or just a tad larger then the 4#3b, he'll have far more space to practice in.

The 5#6 is, if you can believe it, actually smaller than than the 4#3! The rotor diameter is slightly smaller and it's noticably shorter; coupled with being more stable, it 'feels' about half the size.

I've finally killed the controller on mine somehow, but I'm eager to get another one.

[cambs flyer]

Bloody hell mate I'd have never guessed, does it use the same motors as the 4#3b?

Thanks.

[Eddie]

The 5#6 is, if you can believe it, actually smaller than than the 4#3! The rotor diameter is slightly smaller and it's noticably shorter; coupled with being more stable, it 'feels' about half the size.

I've finally killed the controller on mine somehow, but I'm eager to get another one.

Still fly my BuzzFly CX (5G6) most days....there is a new upgrade

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMQcGw9V8P0[/ame]

What have you killed in the controller? I'm sure we might have ideas...

[unwind-protect]

No, the motors it uses are about 2/3rd the height (but two of them, of course).

I'm amazed, but I can't find a good picture on the interweb showing the difference in size. My 5#6 isn't really in a position to have useful photos taken of it right now. Buzzflyer used to have a picture on their website of it being dwarfed by a coke can... ah, something like this:



Dont' know how I killed the controller, something to do with plugging and unplugging motors too roughly, I think; now it just doesn't acknowledge the radio signal. It was beginning to have a number of other little issues, so I was going to get a 5g6 in full alu bling and use the current one as spares.