Tic toc help

[_tj_]

I have been trying / learning Tic-Tocs mainly elevator for months with my Blade 550x
Very occasionally I'll get one, but not very often.

Recently got a Goblin 700c from Weston Park.
I've had a few flights with it to get used to how it flies.

Anyway,
Last Sunday got a bit braver with it, and thought I'd try tic-tocs with it.

First attempt perfect, 2nd attempt perfect.
My mate then took the mickey and said what about Aileron ones.

Somehow I amazed myself and him with a perfect Aileron Tic-toc.

What's bugging me,
Is why can I do them with the G700c and not with the 550x

Any ideas,

I can only put it down to headspeed difference, agility, or is it my collective management.

[crash-test-tomo]

Depending on what sort of errors you are making it could be that you have faster or slower cyclic rates, more or less collective pitch...
headspeed and collective management will obviously make a difference too but try setting the heli up to feel a little more like the other, response, roll rates etc

[_tj_]

I think you may of hit the nail on the head so to speak.

The pitch on both are set to the same on the ikon fbl.

The cyclic rates was another my friend and I were discussing, it seems the g700c cyclic rates are a lot faster on the default setting than the blade 550x.
So that could be the first place to start and up the cyclic rates.

Thanks,
At least I now have a starting place

[Made2Fade]

All sounds normal to me Tony, you need to up the rates on the 550X and this will allow you to do the tick toks easier.
Although to be fair having slower rates should force you to learn the movements properly as you will need to be much more accurate with the collective pitch generally. Slow controlled Tic Toks always look better anyways IMO. Anyone can bang the sticks aggressively allowing the inertia of the model to do a lot of the hard work. Slow and controlled is where its at.
My advice would be open the rates up but not too much to start with.

[crash-test-tomo]

All sounds normal to me Tony, you need to up the rates on the 550X and this will allow you to do the tick toks easier.
Although to be fair having slower rates should force you to learn the movements properly as you will need to be much more accurate with the collective pitch generally. Slow controlled Tic Toks always look better anyways IMO. Anyone can bang the sticks aggressively allowing the inertia of the model to do a lot of the hard work. Slow and controlled is where its at.
My advice would be open the rates up but not too much to start with.

I actually fly my idle up1 at slightly too low of a headspeed on my 550 to force me to be more conscious of collective management

[_tj_]

Thanks Lee,

I prefer slower flying to be honest.
I think it looks much smoother.

Maybe a small amount on the cyclic rate and lots more practice will do it.
Big rainbows are fine, it's then goes pear shaped one I try to make them slightly tighter.

I will get them, if its the last thing I manage lol.

[Made2Fade]

Tony Rainbows are a good starting point for Tic Toks... you can progressively get faster and more controlled with the stick movements. I suppose rainbows may even be classed as an extension of Tic Toks but when you think it can be the other way round also.
Some people are more comfortable with a Tic Toks and then develop Rainbows from that. I've also known people like yourself to be more comfortable with Rainbows but could not sustain Tic Toks. Horses for courses as they say... just like some people are more comfortable with a nose in inverted hover, other tail in inverted.

The best way to learn any new move IMHO is to break it down in to sections. Once you can do each section individually then you string them all together.

[_tj_]

Hehe,

I'm definitely an inverted nose in person lol.
Pretty much got skids in, tail down funnels? Almost everytime.
Inverted tail first circuits (slowly.)

Getting the hang of backwards flying, lots more practice required though.

My progress is getting their, just some things aren't coming as quickly as others lol.

[_tj_]

Well its been a while since this thread started.

Finally my tic tocs are much better on the 550x.
I haven't altered a thing on the fbl controller.

I have however altered my mindset.
It seems the problem I was having was simple now I look back.

I was rushing it.
Now I've slowed down they are much better.

Yesterday I even managed a piro flip for a couple of rotations before pulling out.
Finally feel like I'm getting somewhere lol.

[Peteski]

I find tic-tocs much easier with higher head speed and a healthy power-weight ratio - hides all the mistakes. But again I prefer smooth flying to stick banging so I prefer slower tic-tocs and when you get it right the heli just seems to defy gravity. I also got better at them once I realised that you don't need anywhere near as much collective as you think in the transitions. Just enough to tip it over centre and back each time. I found that too much collective just makes the following transition more aggressive as you have to overcome the inertia from the previous ham-fisted input!