Align T-Rex 450 Plus RTF, Main Rotor Blowout? Help please!!!

[SimMaker]

Hello All

First off let me say "I SURRENDER"... the 450 wins, hands down......... And I throw myself at your mercy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp7ZBpX-wNM

It kind of says it all in the YouTube description. But in short, I have a problem with my T-Rex 450 .......I could really use some hand holding and advice along the way.

My ultimate goal, is to carry cameras for various projects. Feel free to rummage around the other vids..... https://www.youtube.com/user/LGMonaco/videos

I work on simulators of various kinds and ground textures are a bugger to come by, so we figured getting some DSLRs up in the air would be a good way to go.......so, I started looking in to helis and fixed wings (We have another person looking in to the quad side of things).

I know the 450 is not an ideal bird for a beginer, to put it mildly, but for one, I did'nt really know what i was looking for, other than LOTs of power.........which this thing has in spades. And secondly, though the 450 is a 3D machine, I dont want to fly 3D, so if we can get this thing flying again, my next set of questions would be how to dumb it down so it is just a nice stable bird that does things "normal" helicopters would do........one step at a time though.

Looking at the vid. Any ideas what is going on during wind-up?

Cheers

[parksy]

Ok first off I take it you are an enthusiastic amateur. Where did you get heli from? Did you set it up? Have you built it from kit form? Did you get it from Ebay? Take a look at the manual and go through the build stages, read every page and make sure you don't miss pages. If you don't have a manual, get a paper one off ebay or download one from align or google one. The first thing that jumps out is you don't have any paddles or flybar weights on! The type of heli you have is a flybar version, that thin metal rod under the main blades, it acts as a gyro to keep the main blades steady, the paddles keep the flybar in line and balance against the main blades. the fact you don't have them on is what is causing the main blades to go massively out of track, check the vid and watch the main blades, they should follow each other through the air so you only see one blade, not two blades getting further and further apart. If you want to take a DSLR up under a 450, make sure it's a cheap and small one. More power in a 450 isn't the answer, especially when you don't know what you are doing. Learn how to set up a heli, learn how to fly one, move on to larger helis ( but only when you've learnt how to control a smaller one) a larger heli will give you a more stable platform than a more powerful smaller heli. REMEMBER remote helis are not toys, they are unguarded foodblenders, and you wouldn't put any part of yourself in a foodblender..... would you? There is no fast track to flying helis, get a sim, fly that for a bit on a safe pc screen, then try your 450 again with flybar weights and paddles, like in the manual. Oh and don't spin your heli up indoors next to curtains, check how they are wafting towards your heli blades! If the curtain had hit your blades you'd be eating carbon and timber and A&E would be sewing you up. Apart from that welcome to the hobby, be safe and enjoy.

[james_2k]

id be looking at a quadcopter if i was going with a camera rig to be honest. gps control and much more stable for photography and easier to fly

[Grant85]

Align T-Rex 450 Plus RTF, Main Rotor Blowout? Help please!!!

Hey there,

Welcome! 😊

Here is what I'd recommend, I wouldn't recommend using a 450 as a platform for aerial photography or videography, too small and too nimble. Multirotors are the way to go nowadays as the stability on them things is unreal. It doesn't matter how much you 'dumb' down a 450 it will never take good videos.
How well can you fly a 450 anyway may I ask? Assuming you're a beginner and have never flown a collective pitch heli before from what you have wrote in your post.

After looking at that video sorry to say but that is terrible 😕 the blade tracking is so far out due to having no paddles on the flybar, that could've been dangerous spooling that up especially indoors that close to curtains 😕 do yourself a favour, don't spool that thing up again until someone has looked at it who knows what they're doing, I'm saying this from first hand experience when a heli chopped my arm. It looks like to has been involved in a crash in it's last with a broken horizontal fin and I bet that feathering spindle is caput aswell with the blade tracking being as it is.

And if you're thinking that it's going to be just as easy as taking a 450 heli up with a DSLR camera on when you have never flown a CP heli before then you are being very very optimistic. Learn how to fly helis first before you decide on attaching cameras to it. It takes a lot of time and patience to master how to just hover these helis never mind doing aerial footage with them.

However, there is plenty of information on here and loads of nice people to help you out in this hobby but the first thing is safety not just for yourself but for others aswell as these certainly ain't toys.

These can be very dangerous machines if they are in the hands of the wrong person. Any questions just ask away and myself and others will be more than happy to help, we will give you answers and like mine above, they may seem blunt to you at first but it's honest, there's no point me or others filling you with bullsh*t, the honest advice we give is what will save you the heartache mate.

Cheers,
Grant.

[SimMaker]

James_2k.

It says in the text above that we have someone looking in to quads, I came here for help on a technical issue to do with a heli. Forgive me please, but am I in the right forum for tech help?

[SimMaker]

Hi Grant

I know a 450 is not an ideal platform for a cam, I would go to an 800 tomorrow if I could trust myself, maybe even something bigger, purpose built. or just go full scale and get a pilot. I really didnt want to discuss why I am doing what. But, for the moment pretend I don't need a philosophical debate on flight........I just want help geting this thing fixed. Any ideas?

I really am sorry to sound brusk, but I kind of thought I would get an "Ahh, I see your problem" on here......but so far it has been lectures about toys, curtains, reading manuals and why am I flying helis anyway..........

Am I in the right forum?

[james_2k]

you are.. but you have some basic knowledge that you will need prior to flying that thing, check youtube for some info vids.

this video series is a bit old but it covers building and setting up a flybar 450, which is what you have. he also has a lot of helpful stuff on his channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4zJ...5B5CBE36A252EB

and yeah, relax a bit. or the answer you would get is;

"ahh, i see your problem, its not even vaguely set-up, and you are not going about this in the right way."

i only started with helis a couple of months ago, but i now have a working knowledge on setting them up now, all from reading/watching and taking the time it needs to get it done. its not a pickup and play hobby.

[Grant85]

Align T-Rex 450 Plus RTF, Main Rotor Blowout? Help please!!!

Hi Grant

I know a 450 is not an ideal platform for a cam, I would go to an 800 tomorrow if I could trust myself, maybe even something bigger, purpose built. or just go full scale and get a pilot. I really didnt want to discuss why I am doing what. But, for the moment pretend I don't need a philosophical debate on flight........I just want help geting this thing fixed. Any ideas?

I really am sorry to sound brusk, but I kind of thought I would get an "Ahh, I see your problem" on here......but so far it has been lectures about toys, curtains, reading manuals and why am I flying helis anyway..........

Am I in the right forum?

Yes this is the right forum for tech help, and there hasn't been any lectures. Just advice on what the video shows to be a dangerously set up model. And I say 'setup' lightly. That thing looks like is been in a crash has it not? Judging from the broken fin and other dodgy parts on it. Firstly the tail rotor casing isn't perpendicular to the main shaft of the heli. It is all out of line. The feathering shaft I reckon could well be bent. The flybar cage shouldn't have that much movement in it when operating the collective pitch. The flybar has no paddles on it or weights if you're wanting it to be less aggressive. If you could help us out and give us more specs on the heli, your experiences with flying a collective pitch heli so we know what level you are then we know what to recommend to you as the next step to take etc then we can help more.

[tomatwalden]

Simmaker, you're in the right forum, but there's so many things wrong with nit only your heli, but also what you're trying to do.

As others have said, the 450 you have is wholly unsuitable for lifting a camera unless it's a gopro or a keychain camera. A DSLR under a 450 is an accident waiting to happen. And that's even if you're a good heli pilot. As a newbie, sorry but you've got no chance.


Then your heli sure as he'll isn't ready to fly (rtf) honestly it looks a mess. The flybar paddles are missing which is why it goes wrong. Even if your replaced the paddles, tuning a flybar to hold a heli stable is a black art. You'd need to get an expert on it. You'd end up spending hundreds on a heli that looks about £100's worth.


In short, the quad is the right tool for the job here. Do not risk a camera under that machine! Despite your assertion that it has plenty of power, trust me, a proper camera will make it struggle. You need a 550 or bigger for that amount of weight.

Besides which, single rotor helis vibrate so much that they make very poor video or camera platforms.

[SimMaker]

you are.. but you have some basic knowledge that you will need prior to flying that thing, check youtube for some info vids.

this video series is a bit old but it covers building and setting up a flybar 450, which is what you have. he also has a lot of helpful stuff on his channel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4zJ...5B5CBE36A252EB

and yeah, relax a bit. or the answer you would get is;

"ahh, i see your problem, its not even vaguely set-up, and you are not going about this is the right way."

i only started with helis a couple of months ago, but i now have a working knowledge on setting them up now, all from reading/watching and taking the time it needs to get it done. its not a pickup and play hobby.

Cheers James

And yeah, it is a bit of a kick in the berries to come here and get some pretty interesting opening posts. But meh, I'm here to fix a toy helicopter and as long as that gets done, all good.

I have watched his vids, and pretty much all the other ones I can find. And I've rebuilt this thing one or two times before and have some full scale engineering experience. But mostly with fixed wing. So I was pretty sure I had it set up right. then I get to this RPM and booom, the head or blades just kick out like that. Though, watching my vid again, and just looking at the tips of the flybar itself, which we can see becasue the paddles have been removed.......should we see equal lenghts at the ends of the bar as it spins......it seems even with lots of motion blur, that one end of the bar must be sticking out further than the other???.......one, how did I miss that?.........and two, will get the verniers on it tomorrow and double check that...........and three? is that what is casuing it anyway?......all good fun.

Will keep you posted.

OOI, Since it was mentioend above.......

Fixed Wing - Loving and romantice sex with my lovely wife of a few good years......

Helicopters - Exciting passioante sex with my Girlfriend, before she became my wife......

Quads - One night stand or sex with a prostitute....it gets the job done....but it aint flying........

[SimMaker]

Hi All

Lots of posts flying around (pun intended) And as I am a noob here my posts are going to moderation and so things are getting out of sinc.....I will shut my yap for the night and let things settle down and try to respond to you all tomorrow.....

Have I crashed it? lots of times....LOL......I recon even though I only bought one, I have actually bought two over the year or two........this pup is ready for the knackers yard in more ways than one, it was only bought to proove a concept/theory for the work we do. IE, can we use remote or software controled aerial platforms to shoot reference for the work we do.......which is a big yes.......So plan is to move to bigger more stable things..........

But as say, after latest rebuild, and quite liking flying these things..... .....I wound her up again, and then the blades did this and I had brain fade so came here. But looking at YouTube vid of flybar ends, they look way out, so will start there, and start leveling out my servos and swash again......make sure that is all on right, probably left a screw out somewhere....lol.

Cheers

[parksy]

Sim maker if you want advice on a forum, read my advice, wind your neck in, read my advice, you wanted technical advice, I gave you technical advice, read the manual, if you think you can post on a forum, any forum and get some magic answer that will solve all your problems without you having to do anything, and then start slating everyone for giving you an answer you don't want to hear then you have a problem, not with the forum, but with your attitude. I'd like to think I'm a patient chap, but you just shot yourself in the ****. Have fun, be safe.

[electricsceadu]

i'll be blunt
but don't be put off
the first step is that heli needs to be built and set up correctly
the paddles are missing on the flybar
the flybar is not at equal distances from the head block
as we can't see the tx in the first video we have no idea if the controls are working correctly

you need a manual to see how the model is built correctly
i would seek out a local club ,uk on your location doesn't help
and then get advice on how to set the model up and see if they will show you how its done
if you have no local club book a lesson at a flying school to get them to correct the build errors, set the model up and tell you whats wrong and to test fly the model

and that model will never lift into a hover without the paddles fitting to the flybar
and you will need a large amount of room to practice flying a 450 as you have no flying skills as yet

[SimMaker]

electricsceadu

I've been flying it outdoors for over a year........I know the paddles are missing from the flybar, I took them off in an effort to track down the problem. It says so in the YouTube text. I should have made that clear here......it was doing it with the paddles on......so I took them off......and it still did it........so I took the video....and as you and I have noticed, the fly bar is not even centralised, maybe it got a kncok I didnt know about before I locked it down after last fixes (Last fix was a bent flybar, used digital verniers to get the new one central, but the vid shows it is obviously not)....... All Controls are working in the correct directions as they have been since I had the thing which was bought from Align direct as an RTF......... Sorry I did'nt film TX.

parsky, re "winding my neck in". With respect, I appreciate your advice and observations on the blades not tracking, and thats why I took the vid. But at the same time that I could wind my neck in, maybe you should not make so very very many assumptions. Get a Sim? been flying them for years. I make them for a living, as a professional, not a freeware developer(though have done that in the past too).......You have probably played/trained on Sims I have worked on........Curtains and A&E? Please, and on you went with many questions, when all I wanted was some advice on the blade blowout........Did you even see how it was tethered to the ground? Do you know how big the work area is, how much zoom was on the camera lense? How far away the curtains are? And you assume people need to be told these things are "not toys", Really???? Sorry, that gets my goat. Neck Out! But no biggie, so we clashed heads........I can live with it if you can.

What I really wanted was help on why the head and blades on this thing is going on the frizz at a certain throttle settting.......but will prolly be best if I just go over it all again, again...lol......and find out what step I have skipped or botched. cheers.

[Grant85]

I'm not even sure if you're being serious anymore or just trolling. You said in your opening post that you're a beginner yet now you say that you've been flying it for years [emoji53]
Something quite not right here, you have come onto here with a really bad attitude mate. This is a really good forum with nice people on but you can't expect to come here with your first ever posts and then get up people's backs! After we have gone to the efforts of trying to help you.

And now you're bragging about how you make sims that we most likely 'play' on blah blah. So let me get this right, if you make sims for a living, I would have thought that you would be be able to at least fly and set up helis properly otherwise how can you develop simulators when they are made off the back of heli physics and how they work/fly. Also you don't even know that a heli should have paddles on and you have taken them off to try 'eliminate' a vibration, are you for real?
Anyone with any knowldege in this hobby knows that will just make ten times worse LOL!

Well I'm sorry but I no longer wish to give you any of my advice. You have just come on here asked advice and when we have given you it you have just thrown it in our faces. Good luck with your 450 and I hope you don't end up eating it with a DSLR attached to the bottom. Ciao! [emoji107]