How do you set max cyclic pitch?

[machasm]

I agree that there is some confusion here. But as J-S-Q has said 30 deg would be beyond stalling so setting the cyclic range isn't a bad idea.
I guess with my setup I tend to fly a little more gentle and don't often get to the extremes of the throws on cyclic as well as collective.
As for measuring the cyclic range,
set the pitch to zero then with the blades in line with the boom push the ael stick over and adjust menu L for the desired throw (Maybe 8 deg or so for you?)
make sure you do both left and right.
Then move the blades so that they are 90 deg to the boom and adjust menu L for elevator the same way.
Ade.

[J-S-Q]

I reckon you measure the cyclic pitch just like in a flybared, as Machasm says, by setting the collective to mid stick and then measure cyclic pitch. From what I remember of the setup process, you don't have to set up elevator and aileron (or left/right) separately -there's just one overall setting for cyclic pitch.

[Lynx.1677]

I agree that there is some confusion here. But as J-S-Q has said 30 deg would be beyond stalling so setting the cyclic range isn't a bad idea.
I guess with my setup I tend to fly a little more gentle and don't often get to the extremes of the throws on cyclic as well as collective.
As for measuring the cyclic range,
set the pitch to zero then with the blades in line with the boom push the ael stick over and adjust menu L for the desired throw (Maybe 8 deg or so for you?)
make sure you do both left and right.
Then move the blades so that they are 90 deg to the boom and adjust menu L for elevator the same way.
Ade.

I know how to measure cyclic pitch but I wasn't sure at what point I do it? Point L, point K, normal flight mode. The guy on BeastX says there is no need to measure it at all which just sounds mad. Also, the amount of pitch you get at point L, doesn't equal the pitch you get during flight. So, the algorithm is overly complicated or I am missing something here.

[ChrisB]

Set it to the cyclic limit without binding at extremes,inflight the system will limit the amount itself same as the V bar does.

[Lynx.1677]

Set it to the cyclic limit without binding at extremes,inflight the system will limit the amount itself same as the V bar does.

Which is exactly what I have done. I set it to full movement and get no binding at all. Yet still there are issues when you give quick cyclic inputs with tail and pitch. When I mentioned about lowering this point in step L Steffan replied:

"If the heli wobbles in stationary flips try to reduce Pot 2 on the MICROBEAST and rise Pot 1. That has nothing to do with giving 16° of cyclic pitch.

As I said this is only the possible range for the MICROBEAST to work. When using a flybared head you can directly steer appr. 7-8° cyclic and when tilting the flybar it will additionaly do 8-10°. So you also have to make this possible for the "electrical flybar" MICROBEAST to have this range of 16°. When in very fast forward flight it will have to automatically steer nose down and roll left to compensate the rotary moments what of course you cannot see. But when you now want to perform a roll you will additionally need the same amount of cyclic pitch like for performing a stationary roll. So here you can get in regions of 12 - 14 deg and if you limit too much at point L the unit will not have a chance to compensate these moments. But when doing a stationary flip or piroflip-like movement as in your video you will never get in such high regions. Setup point L is only there to define the "headroom" for the MICROBEAST and tell it where the limits are and to prevent mechanical binding.

With your transmitter you do not directly steer 16° when giving 100% stick input you only give the command to roll the heli with full speed. How much degrees this will be on the head is for the MICROBEAST to decide. When giving the stick command to roll it will try to do exactly this. If there occurs some difference between your stick command and the movement of the heli it seems as there is something not adjusted correct in the control loop... so I'd suggest to try playing around with the Pots 1 and 2. By reducing the travel adjust end points or using DualRates you will decrease the roll rate (just as you would not deflect the stick so far) and so give the system more time to react. So it should get better although reducing rollrates is of course not what you want but this can be a sign that the control loop is not adjusted correct."

It seems that you give the beast the amount the head can do maximum and it 'decides' using an algorithm how much to actually use. In short, you never tell it how much pitch to use at max other than what the head is capable of. This to me would seem to be where the issue is. The beast doesn't see there is an issue when using max cyclic, pitch and also piro'ing and therefore seems to get itself confused.

I will try reducing the amount at point L to 13 degrees just to see what happens.

[cupracing]

stick the flybar back on it Dan and have some fun.

surely flybarless can be worth all this hassle and expense.

just my 2p

[ChrisB]

Yes this is the same with the V bar,it decides how much cyclic pitch to use,you dont even set the full positive and negative endpoint on that only zero pitch centre stick,it decides how much it can or cant use,,,clever stuff

[Sieze2]

Okay, thanks guys I think I am getting there. What is unclear is where do I set my max cyclic pitch? Step K only allows me to setup collective pitch which I have set to +/- 12 degrees which is fine.

Do I limit cyclic pitch at step L?

Listen stop thinking like you are still flying a flybared model !

Set J to 6 degrees and K to 13 degrees. Thats it! The blades won't stall and the heli won't fall out of the sky !

If you want to slow the roll rate (note with a flybar you would do this by decreasing cyclic pitch) you simply decrease the servo endpoint for elevator if you want it to flip slow. Decrease the aileron end point to slow the roll rate etc. Changing the endpoints with a beastx will not necessitate a re-setup (unlike adjusting the Swash mix on a 3G which will need to be reset-up).

You will find the 100% endpoints are sufficient to start with. Remember you can also change the control behaviour in the parameters menu.

[J-S-Q]

Having read Steffan's explanation, it does make sense that you should actually set up for maximum available pitch -I hadn't thought of the additional pitch that was added from the tilting flybar. So I guess this is probably not the cause of your problem. Any luck getting some shorter servo horns?

[Vanquish]

Where is your swashplate gain (pot 1) set?

Haven't tried the beastx in anything smaller than a 500 but did notice this from beastx manual - "When using small helicopters like 250 or 450 size reduce the swashplate gain slightly"

[Lynx.1677]

Where is your swashplate gain (pot 1) set?

Haven't tried the beastx in anything smaller than a 500 but did notice this from beastx manual - "When using small helicopters like 250 or 450 size reduce the swashplate gain slightly"

I've tried it all the way down, stock and also just slightly reduced (-2). Doesn't make any difference to the issue really.

I reduced the step L point a little and the problem seems to be less severe. I will try reducing it to just so I get the blue LED and see what happens. This shouldn't be the solution though.

Also, when using the trasmitter value to adjust the cyclic behaviour, how do you decrease the aileron/elevator amounts? I've heard travel endpoints but also dualrates which are two different functions. I'm using a DX7, some clarity here would be good.

[J-S-Q]

Also, when using the trasmitter value to adjust the cyclic behaviour, how do you decrease the aileron/elevator amounts? I've heard travel endpoints but also dualrates which are two different functions. I'm using a DX7, some clarity here would be good.

You use the ELE/AIL endpoints to adjust the flip/roll rates, just like you use rudder endpoints to adjust yaw rate. I think some people maybe use the term dualrates when really they mean endpoints.

I posted about this on the BeastX forum and with a DX7, if you have the 'Control Behaviour' set to 'Radio' then approximately 100% will give you the maximum flip/roll rates but sometimes this can need up to 110% depending on your setup but from what I can gather, there is no point setting your endpoints any higher than that as you will not get faster flip/roll rates.

Servo travel limits and roll/flip rate..

[J-S-Q]

I reduced the step L point a little and the problem seems to be less severe. I will try reducing it to just so I get the blue LED and see what happens. This shouldn't be the solution though.

Maybe you are finally on the right track then. I reckon you should try reducing it a quite lot, down to say 7 or 8 degrees, just as an experiment. After all, it's very quick to do. Mine has something like 8 degrees and the roll/flip rates are still pretty fast I'd say but I don't fly proper 3D so possibly this would limit performance too much for your flying style. Worth a try though.

Incidentally, I didn't notice any mention of the LED colour in the manual for step L so I'm not sure what it means or if it's even relevant.

[machasm]

I used the ATVs on Ael and elev and had to set mine to 120% to get the agility I wanted.
I am using "radio" mode.

[Planehazza]

Have you watched these?

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQBOqa95zrQ"]YouTube - Microbeast Setup: general considerations part 1[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-M6x0mo7DzM&feature=related"]YouTube - Microbeast setup part 2[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yj39SaBt88&feature=related"]YouTube - Microbeast setup part 3[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roU6a3UlS7U&feature=related"]YouTube - Microbeast setup part 4[/ame]

They helped my setup a lot


J is where you setup 6 degrees of cyclic. This is simply much cyclic control you'll have. K is the "cyclic ring" function. While not a true cyclic ring, it stops the head/swash from binding when extreme inputs are added. Not that you'd likely ever do it, but you can imagine full aileron, elavator and pitch at once is going to put the swash plate in extreme angles. My understand is that in this step, you put the pitch to min and max and give full simultaneous aileron and elevator. If it binds, back of using the rudder stick.