3G and poor cyclic/elevator response

[tourerjim]

That is a myth that's been going round since regular gyros, rotation is rotation, each gyro will experience the same number of degrees it has turned through at the same rate at any point on the helicopter, even if it was on a 10ft poll sticking out the nose.

The only way it would experience anything different is if the heli contorted itself, which doesn't generally happen unless gravity has won that day.

The important thing is making sure its level, and the cyclic axies are aligned with roll and pitch, and that there as little vibration as possible.

Myth or not, not an argument I want to get into as it wasn't a myth when I done it on my heli barring in mind when 3G first came out we all tried various ways to get the best we could out of it" as it was only on v1 at the time & I never moved from there even when the next firmware update came out.

[coolice]

Seeming as coolice is the resident expert on 3G setup, after reading many posts about them....

What settings would you suggest for the trex 500, could I use the 450pro file attached to this thread?

Thanks alot
Ian

Hello mate.

You could try my 450 pro settings and they wouldn't do no harm, but these ones have been altered to remove a lot of the elevator porpoising in fast forward flight experienced on the small models.

Personally I would say give my 550 settings a go first and see if you like them as I recently wrote them to a friends Trex500 and they feel really good on it. They to have been tailored to remove as much elevator bounce and fast forward porpoising as possible, but the larger models do not suffer to the same extent as the smaller ones did I found. Hence they are not so aggressively altered in the parameters which effect these flight quirks.

Keep me posted on what you think once you have tried them.
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[coolice]

Hi Ian I used the coolice settings on a 550 and a 700. The v3 update also flies very well, I could not tell a lot of diffrence, Fewest tail kicks out of all the updates i tried Cheers Jason

Hi Jason.

Glad to hear you are liking V3, I to found the tail to be better overall but just felt the cyclic performance wasn't as good as with V2.1 and so downgraded. But we all fly differently and so the update suits some and nto others, it's been the same for other makers FBL systems to with some prefering the updates and others not.

If you find anything else you particularly like or dislike along the way let us know mate.
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[IanC]

Hello mate.

You could try my 450 pro settings and they wouldn't do no harm, but these ones have been altered to remove a lot of the elevator porpoising in fast forward flight experienced on the small models.

Personally I would say give my 550 settings a go first and see if you like them as I recently wrote them to a friends Trex500 and they feel really good on it. They to have been tailored to remove as much elevator bounce and fast forward porpoising as possible, but the larger models do not suffer to the same extent as the smaller ones did I found. Hence they are not so aggressively altered in the parameters which effect these flight quirks.

Keep me posted on what you think once you have tried them.
.

Thanks alot ian

I will give them a try... Just need the weather to improve a bit...

Ian

[IanC]

Hi Ian I used the coolice settings on a 550 and a 700. The v3 update also flies very well, I could not tell a lot of diffrence, Fewest tail kicks out of all the updates i tried Cheers Jason

Cheers Jason

See you soon

Thanks

Ian

[coolice]

Cheers Jason

See you soon

Thanks

Ian

Hey.

You're welcome buddy.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I thought it was rough out flying yesterday in the wind and then rain, but today was even worse! Still had to get my flying fix ;-)
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[paulsouthport]

Hey all, especially Coolice!

My Pro has been flying great on Coolices 3G settings, until I put a 15t on last night. Tried it today and it was terrible. Was hoping for ballistic, got mentallistic. Cyclic was crazy bad, uncommanded pitching and rolling like crazy. Truly horrible.

I'm assuming vibes are killing the sensor, but just to check, should I calm the 3G settings down a bit?
I've put the 13t back on for now, need my flight fix, but also really want the ballistic response...

ta!

EDIT: Sorry - I put a 14t on, not 15t.

[coolice]

Hey Paul.

Ah cool, thanks for the compliment on the settings working great :-)

With increased head speed comes a more responsive rotor disk, so you would perhaps need to dial down the gains slightly and you're flip and roll rates if you felt they were to quick. Of course vibration will also increase with speed if there is any on the model.

Where have you mounted the 3G sensor out of interest?
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[paulsouthport]

Hi mate

The sensor is on the gyro plate, behind the anti-rotation.
I can't really say the flip and roll rates are too fast, it was simply too manic to fly! Thing was all over the place and it was a fight to keep it in the air and skids facing down. Even spool up was an unpleasant experience.

[coolice]

Hi mate

The sensor is on the gyro plate, behind the anti-rotation.
I can't really say the flip and roll rates are too fast, it was simply too manic to fly! Thing was all over the place and it was a fight to keep it in the air and skids facing down. Even spool up was an unpleasant experience.

Hey.

It is known the ainti-rotation plate is a source of vibration, more so in any aggressive manouvers where the anti-rotation pin knocks against the guide in flight. However I had my 3G mounted here on my own 450 PRO and it seemed to work well, mounting pads will effect this, but I was using a single Align 3G pad.
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[paulsouthport]

I took the 450 out again today - perfect weather for it.

All was good until about 1 min in when there was major 45 degree tail kick in level forward flight. Odd. Brought it down, checked the sensor was secure, no teeth missing, tail blades good, all looked normal.
Tried again, same result.
I'm going to strip the tail and check bearings etc. but is has anyone experienced this before?

[coolice]

I took the 450 out again today - perfect weather for it.

All was good until about 1 min in when there was major 45 degree tail kick in level forward flight. Odd. Brought it down, checked the sensor was secure, no teeth missing, tail blades good, all looked normal.
Tried again, same result.
I'm going to strip the tail and check bearings etc. but is has anyone experienced this before?

Hey Buddy.

This was a quirk of the 3G on the odd occasion, the dreaded tail kick. Sometimes you would go for many flights and not see any, then you'd get one or two in a single flight. Quite why it happens I still do not know, I have a theory it happens more when the weather is warmer and also tail servo used effects it I think, but either theory is unproven.

A slipping auto hub can give the same symptoms, but at long as this is ok and the gears are fine I would say it's just a 3G tail kick.

How much delay are you running on the tail? I ran 30% and this can be seen in the settings screen on the PC interface, if you're not running any try adding some.
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[paulsouthport]

Hi Ian

I checked it over mechanically and it all looks sound, although I may just swap all tail bearings anyway, they've been in all winter, and there is a high freq side to side tail vibe at about half way up the spool up that disappears at flight speed. It was a very hot day too.

I'll check the delay tonight and set to 30%, thanks for the tip, I'll try to get out tomorrow lunch time to test.

cheers
Paul

[aparkin]

hi sorry to reserect a old thread but i just wanted to thank coolice for great posts you have solved my problems so simply big thanks m8

[coolice]

hi sorry to reserect a old thread but i just wanted to thank coolice for great posts you have solved my problems so simply big thanks m8 [ATTACH=CONFIG]52335[/ATTACH]

Hey.

You're very welcome buddy, glad to have helped.

Any other questions give me a shout.
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