New Blade 200 with panic button........a gimmick?

[colintainsh]

I wonder if this will be another flying circuit board with a gimmick, i know the ones they have for the planes are rubbish, mind you that was a few years ago i seen one on HKing that will bring the plane back to you. when i fly the nano or msrx and it gets away from me as oft it does, no problem just chop the throttle and it will fall on to the grass, with a bigger model it would probably start costing in repairs. Horizon Hobby people dont seem as helpfull as they used to be, mabye too many Helis where getting sent back to them, any way give me your thoughts if any on the new Blade 200 if you have the time, thanks.

[Bhujang]

Horizon Hobby people dont seem as helpfull as they used to be, mabye too many Helis where getting sent back to them

+1 to that and it has really put me off trying anything further from them so can't advice about this new model. I think it's supposed bring the heli back to a sat coordinate and not allow to close a proximity to you and the tx. But I'm only guessing.

[tomatwalden]

The 200X is more than just a bigger blade with a panic button, it's quite a sophisticated piece of kit and arguably the best beginner/trainer model there has ever been. Albeit perhaps not the cheapest, and therefore not right for everyone.

Being fixed pitch, the blades aren't dangerously fast. Unlike most other fixed-pitch however, it's flybarless and benefits from 2 levels of stability - from co-axial aggressive stability through to neutral stability as per CP helis. The "panic" button, AFAIK, just rights the heli and returns it to a stable hover - no different from the rescue functions on the SK720 or Bavarian Demon units. You wouldn't call those gimmicks I suspect ??

Right now, if somebody popped up asking for a beginner heli, I wouldn't hesistate to recommend this (assuming it matched their budget).

As for HH - can't really comment as I haven't had recourse to call them recently. However, it seems odd to me to criticise the level of support from them in the UK, when I can't think of any other manufacturer that actually HAS any direct support in the UK. (ie. not via resellers or distributors). Something is surely better than nothing!?

[3dx]

The 200X is more than just a bigger blade with a panic button, it's quite a sophisticated piece of kit and arguably the best beginner/trainer model there has ever been. Albeit perhaps not the cheapest, and therefore not right for everyone.

Being fixed pitch, the blades aren't dangerously fast. Unlike most other fixed-pitch however, it's flybarless and benefits from 2 levels of stability - from co-axial aggressive stability through to neutral stability as per CP helis. The "panic" button, AFAIK, just rights the heli and returns it to a stable hover - no different from the rescue functions on the SK720 or Bavarian Demon units. You wouldn't call those gimmicks I suspect ??

Right now, if somebody popped up asking for a beginner heli, I wouldn't hesistate to recommend this (assuming it matched their budget).

As for HH - can't really comment as I haven't had recourse to call them recently. However, it seems odd to me to criticise the level of support from them in the UK, when I can't think of any other manufacturer that actually HAS any direct support in the UK. (ie. not via resellers or distributors). Something is surely better than nothing!?

Absolutely as I can't think of another company that fixes most of their products-whether its user induced or equipment failure and mostly for free !!,, with the feedback I get from 2 model shop owners and local flyers in my area- HH are doing ok in my book , now lets see if they can sort out my two 130x's,,,,,.

[Zeeflyboy]

To be honest I've already started recommending it to guys that ask me what a good first "proper" heli might be (proper as opposed to the cheap co-axial toy junk you see in the shops).

I think it'll be extremely hard to beat as a first step into the heli world.

[colintainsh]

To be honest I've already started recommending it to guys that ask me what a good first "proper" heli might be (proper as opposed to the cheap co-axial toy junk you see in the shops).

I think it'll be extremely hard to beat as a first step into the heli world.

Yes I think you are right, I wonder if you loose your heli, as oft I do, you have no idea how to get it back, if you press the panic button it will level itself out, what will happen if it was moving forward at the time, will it still be going away from you, albiet at level flight, if it does what would happen if you reduce throttle might it be able to land itself, now that would be handy.

[Zeeflyboy]

New Blade 200 with panic button........a gimmick?

The "panic" button will just self level it, as it has no GPS or other external reference by which to hold position.

Therefore, if you had any significant momentum in a given direction it will continue to slide along. It should be very easy to arrest that movement however with a stick input even for very inexperienced fliers.

If you reduce throttle then it will land useful, but if you are sliding sideways or backwards at the time it may tumble on the ground.

The panic mode is basically reverting to the most aggressive stability mode and should turn it into a co-axial-esque heli in terms of feel and response.

[Vrp]

Unofficial Video - Blade 200 SR X - YouTube

If you haven't seen this before

[colintainsh]

Unofficial Video - Blade 200 SR X - YouTube

If you haven't seen this before

Got to have it

[sp4rky-m4rky]

Doesn’t look that great, I don’t like all the self-level stuff that has come about. Same as a lot of the multirotors. Sure it makes it easier to fly but it is quite a different way of flying and doesn’t teach you the part that in my opinion is difficult to learn. Its quite a different way of flying when using self level. To maintain forward flight for example, you have to keep pushing forward stick. If the pitch angle is set then you just hold full forward stick and fly around. To slow up you release the stick and it levels out. It’s a bit of a shock when you go to fly it correctly. Many multirotors are even worse in as much as they have position hold too.

I have flown with a number of people that only fly multirotors and generally they all rely incredibly on the gps hold and stabilisation. They are all bad pilots and despite having been flying for a long time they are still unable to control a unestablised single rotor. So many people are coming through claiming to be able to fly a helicopter but most cant even hover something we fly. The issue for the people I know that are flying aerial photography rigs is that without the skill to fly properly, they are giving so much more of the control to the computing and then having to fight it to get it to do exactly what they want. Normally this results in footage that isn’t as smooth or having the camera in the wrong place.

How long did it take most of us to learn to hover? Add self level and it pretty much does it for you. Add gps and barometer and it will do it. You have just bypassed that whole learning stage. In my opinion that is a pretty crucial stage. Do you go back and learn it later on (all the multirotor pilots I know never have) and how much easier really is it compared to learning it straight off?

Great, you get quick results but more than likely don’t progress much further than that because after that initial success you don’t want to go to not being able to fly it. Get a sim, have a play, go out and fly, sure you crash but you also learn. A few crashes later you will be in a position far beyond that which this can ever teach you.

[tomatwalden]

Doesn’t look that great, I don’t like all the self-level stuff that has come about. Same as a lot of the multirotors. Sure it makes it easier to fly but it is quite a different way of flying and doesn’t teach you the part that in my opinion is difficult to learn. Its quite a different way of flying when using self level. To maintain forward flight for example, you have to keep pushing forward stick. ...

That's the beauty of the 200SRX. Previously you had a choice - aggressive self-levelling helis (co-axials or 45-degree flybars), or no self-levelling at all (mSRX and all collective pitch). This now gives you both at the flick of a switch. An absolute COMPLETE beginner can now bypass the co-axial stage and start with this as self-levelling and rescue mode make it good for that. BUT, choose advanced mode, and it loses the self-stabilisation and flies exactly like a collective pitch and consequently has the speed to fly outdoors quite comfortably. In advanced mode, you DON'T need to keep pushing forward stick - it will fly with neutral stability - perfect for transition to collective pitch.

It's not for everyone, but it strikes me that one heli that takes you from absolute newbie right through to CP style flying is no bad thing.

[colintainsh]

Doesn’t look that great, I don’t like all the self-level stuff that has come about. Same as a lot of the multirotors. Sure it makes it easier to fly but it is quite a different way of flying and doesn’t teach you the part that in my opinion is difficult to learn. Its quite a different way of flying when using self level. To maintain forward flight for example, you have to keep pushing forward stick. If the pitch angle is set then you just hold full forward stick and fly around. To slow up you release the stick and it levels out. It’s a bit of a shock when you go to fly it correctly. Many multirotors are even worse in as much as they have position hold too.

I have flown with a number of people that only fly multirotors and generally they all rely incredibly on the gps hold and stabilisation. They are all bad pilots and despite having been flying for a long time they are still unable to control a unestablised single rotor. So many people are coming through claiming to be able to fly a helicopter but most cant even hover something we fly. The issue for the people I know that are flying aerial photography rigs is that without the skill to fly properly, they are giving so much more of the control to the computing and then having to fight it to get it to do exactly what they want. Normally this results in footage that isn’t as smooth or having the camera in the wrong place.

How long did it take most of us to learn to hover? Add self level and it pretty much does it for you. Add gps and barometer and it will do it. You have just bypassed that whole learning stage. In my opinion that is a pretty crucial stage. Do you go back and learn it later on (all the multirotor pilots I know never have) and how much easier really is it compared to learning it straight off?

Great, you get quick results but more than likely don’t progress much further than that because after that initial success you don’t want to go to not being able to fly it. Get a sim, have a play, go out and fly, sure you crash but you also learn. A few crashes later you will be in a position far beyond that which this can ever teach you.

Thanks for that, i thought if you went to advanced mode there would be no self leveling, it was the panic button feature i liked, cause i cant fly my Nano and MSRX that i have,( i can fly them just not too far away i mean) i just cant see them if they get away, the Club i am in has only planes, i was told there the only reason that i can fly the nano and msrx is because of the aids built in to them, i have to work at them to them hovering in one place, the Blade MCPX bl and Blade 130 i have need constant input to keep them level, i have not flown them much i was learning orientation on the smaller micros first. If the Blade 200 has this self level feature all the time, i can see the problems you mentioned. I will have to think about it now 150 pounds is a lot of money, if its not going to help me fly.

[tomatwalden]

Thanks for that, i thought if you went to advanced mode there would be no self leveling,.

There isn't. In advanced mode, the 200SRX will behave exactly like a collective pitch heli. It does not self-level all the time.

[sp4rky-m4rky]

There isn't. In advanced mode, the 200SRX will behave exactly like a collective pitch heli. It does not self-level all the time.

I understand that you can turn it off, I can see your points. I guess you could say that it shouldn’t be a disadvantage but it could be argued that it wont necessarily be that much of an advantage. My analogy with the multirotors though was that in those cases there is ability to disable the self-level and the position hold too, but from my experience people don’t do so because they feel it is too difficult to go back. They also have developed the muscle memory from the beginning where they are used to controlling something that self-levels.

No question that this will get people flying quicker but whether it will get them flying properly sooner is in my opinion quite questionable.

[Zeeflyboy]

disagree in general with you marcus...

The comparison to multi-rotors is not particularly relevant imo as you are operating from a pre-conceived notion of what "proper" flying should be. Fact is that most people flying a multi-rotor want to use it for FPV/AP/UAV purposes and that is a very different style of flying to 3D or even sport CP heli flying - the end goals just aren't the same. It ends up a bit elitist when you say it's not proper flying... it is, it's just different. Perhaps using a FBL controller isn't proper flying - too much electronic help going on there, true pilots ditch the flybar AND the flybarless controller? It's doable, but it ain't pretty in my experience! Fact is every time you fly your FBL heli you are flying an electronically stabilised machine and with FB it's just mechanically stabilised.

There is also no comparison between trying to get some nice video for example using a quad in a self stabilising mode and in manual mode in my experience, and I can fly manual mode pretty well imo... I would never choose manual for that. if they are fighting the craft then they haven't learned to fly/configure it properly in that mode and practising in manual isn't necessarily going to help... if anything they need to practise more in the stabilised modes and understand it better. Flying FPV with a quad is far more enjoyable in general using a self stabilising mode (my favourite is horizon mode which is a kind of centre stick self stabilising mode but with no angle limits that blends the ease of stabilised with the speed and agility of manual). Using a Quad for UAV purposes generally all they are interested in is recovering from unexpected behaviour or guiding it in for a landing/takeoff - no need to mess around with manual mode for that.

Back to the arguments that are relevant imo, there is a clear progression here with the three modes... anyone interested in the hobby will look to progress along the modes and end up flying in expert. Anyone who isn't really that interested will just keep flying in the first two modes and why shouldn't they? its great that more people can access the hobby at some level... perhaps all they want is a small heli to play with in the back yard and couldn't care less about "proper" flying - no problem imo.

The biggest thing the stabilised modes can do if you are interested in progressing to flying non-actively stabilised craft is teach you orientation without crashing every 10 seconds, and that's a big deal in my opinion... it won't magically make you be able to fly in expert mode or a CP heli straight away but it's a big step towards that goal... the next step is learning the small muscle memory type reactions that the stabilisation is currently doing for you, but at least you've got one hurdle out the way.